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Anonymous
Dear /trv/,

American here. I may be going to England for graduate school (I'm an English literature sort of fellow), and I get the feeling I may want to just stay there if I do. Of course, I don't know that, but better I go there for school and stay if I like it than ship over there and just try to get a job, right?

Anyway, I ask you for a couple pieces of advice:

1) What sort of procedure is there for an American to become a British subject? I understand that any sort of procedure would require quite a few years, but I'm prepared for that.

2) I imagine that, living in Europe, being at least bilingual would be a good idea. I've studied some French and some German--which one would be most useful for me to continue learning? I'd like to continue both, but I can't decide which is more important to learn first.

Thanks, /trv/!
>> Anonymous
>>8355
OP again. I appear to have used antiquated terminology and what I meant was "British citizen." British subject isn't used in that context anymore, is it?
>> Anonymous
Enjoy your police state. Seriously, as bad as the Bush administration has been, there's LESS privacy in Britain. Security cameras all over the place in cities.
>> Anonymous
>>8358
London is the only city with lots of cameras. Ignore these faggots talking about lack of privacy. There's nothing as bad as the PATRIOT ACT in the UK. There is a National Database being discussed by the current party, but every other party is against it and it's likely to go nowhere.

>>8355
> I imagine that, living in Europe, being at least bilingual would be a good idea.
Does not apply in England. Unless you plan to teach Eng Lit to French or German people. French is more popular here as a foreign language, but only useful if you go to France on holidays. Likewise with German.

>What sort of procedure is there for an American to become a British subject?
The fact that you're American will have no advantages or disadvantages in naturalisation, other than the English Language requirement, which won't be a problem (I guess, you speak English as your first language/at native level, right?)

If you are not married to a British citizen, you must live here for 5 years before you can apply. You've also got to have a job which will require you to live here for a while too, to make sure you remain in the country and use that citizenship.

If you decide to marry someone, you only have to live here for 3 years before applying.

Britfag out.
>> Anonymous
>>8358
>Security cameras all over the place in cities.
Hope you don't live in New York, it's hardly clear of CCTV cameras. We're all being watched. Not that it matters, cameras don't do anything.
>> Anonymous
Check the EU's or specifically Britain's immigration sites.

I applied for my 1-year Australian citizenship online. It's not very complicated and the service I got was very personal.
>> Anonymous
>>8370
>I applied for my 1-year Australian citizenship online.
/r/ more info on this plz... It only took you 1 year to get AUS citizenship?
>> Anonymous
>>8355
1) Don't know.
2) French is probably more useful for communicating in Europe since Germans are known for speaking good English. Learn German if you like opera and Goethe!

But in Britain the average middle class person will speak only English and a bit of basic French.
>> Anonymous
>>8370
Oh fuck, I meant 1 year tourist VISA. My bad.
It took about two months to process, sending emails with various information such as bank statements back and forths.
>> UK living Cleotis
I was a British post-grad (graduate student in US) from 1994-1999 (Phd Keele). I'd wait to make those kind of decisions till I'd been there a while. You've got to get over the cultural shock -- mostly little things -- before you can tell if living there is for you.

That said, I sometimes regret not staying.
>> Anonymous
It's surprisingly common for Europeans to speak one language fluently and another very patchily; you wouldn't stand out or be considered ignorant if you only spoke English and, say, a little bit of French or Spanish (I mean very little).

As for the procedure, it's far easier for you to come our way than us yours. Recently, however, there have been more and more calls for qualified professionals only to be considered, but it will realistically take a long time for that to be made law. Since you're a postgrad you'd be pretty much welcomed with open arms.

My advice is to not bother with London. It's brutal Darwinism. It's basically where everyone in Britain goes to compete for jobs, and it's really hectic and generally not a particularly nice place to settle or even live for more than 5 or so years (in my opinion, anyway). I would say try and get into a really beautiful county like Devon, Oxfordshire, Gloucestershire, parts of Yorkshire, Dorset and Kent (basically the south coast of England).

Also, I remember reading about Scotland having a programme for qualified foreign immigrants, apparently they're trying to bring in university educated types who would otherwise go to London. The Scottish will generally like Americans (especially if you express your hatred for the English) and you'd probably enjoy it. Glasgow and Edinburgh are really the only two decent-sized cities, though.

You'll hear a lot about the North/South divide when asking about England. This is basically where the South Coast, East Anglia and a few commuter towns north of London are considered to be home to the rich and traditionally middle/upper class Britons, whereas north of around Northampton the population becomes poorer.
>> Anonymous
>>8379

cont.


This is mostly true (coming from someone born in the northernmost city in England) but it's not as bad most people think. The South is the principal region of the nation, and if you're going to England for the first time I sincerely recommend you head there to get an idea of the country. There are some fantastic places in the North, but most of the work and what you would consider "Britishness" is in the South.
>> Anonymous
>>8381
Yeah, in North you can find a lot of closed mines and people that want to tear Thatcher into small tiny bits.
>> Anonymous
how in the hell can you afford the overseas student rates?
>> Anonymous
>>8379
OP here. The University of Oxford is actually my first choice for grad school (you know, assuming I can get in), so I'd be in Oxfordshire anyway if I had my way. I've heard wonderful things about not only the university but the city from friends of mine who've spent semesters abroad there.

If it helps job-wise, given that I'd like to get a Ph.D. in English literature (studying largely modern 20th- and 21st-century works as well as the synthesis of poetry and music), which pretty much means I intend to work at a university. I'd assume this places me in a slightly different job market than what you've described in London, though I can't, of course, be too sure.

>>8376
Yeah, I'm basically just trying to get a feel for how things work overall there before I go. I have no idea if I'm going to stay or not, and I figure that if I just go there for grad school and decide to leave after, it was still a worthwhile experience; and if I decide to stay, then of course that's good, too.

Thanks to everyone for the advice and information!
>> Anonymous
>>8407

There are some decent university jobs, definitely. The UK is the next educational powerhouse after the US.

If you do decide to stay and try for citizenship, by the time you have it Europe will probably be even more federalist than it's already trying to be now. So, basically, having a British passport would mean you would also have a French one, and a German one, etc. etc. (this is the de facto arrangement now).

That's about the best thing about being European, I think. Also, the ancient and persistent light of human civilization etc.
>> Cleotis
I would check out other uni options aside from Oxbridge for your degree. Also, get a feel for the British approach to post-grad education. You can go from a BA to a PhD without an MA in some programs, but a British PhD is a much different experience -- no classes, just a thesis (80-100,000 words).

What I'm saying is, think broadly about what you want. Transfers between unis are unheard of in the UK, as far as I know.
>> Anonymous
>>8413

>Transfers between unis are unheard of in the UK, as far as I know.

It happens, but I think it's perhaps easier and more common in the US.
>> Anonymous
OP reporting in!

>>8413
Yeah, I'm certainly doing my research before I go anywhere. I intend to apply to as many different schools as I can, at least ones to which I'd want to go. And I'm fully prepared to write a massive thesis--I prepared myself mentally for that as soon as I decided I'd want a Ph.D.
>> Anonymous
my aunt has lived in Britain since the mid eighties, is a civil servant there, and while she is a legal resident i don't think she is a citizen, she is still a citizen of the US.
>> Anonymous
>>8424
Nice to know I guess...
>> Anonymous
Englandfag here...if your even considering moving to England drop your french...learn pakistani m8...punjab is also fine,,,
ps.Whatever you think about us*you know being snobs and saying things like Oh dear...and blood hell..your wrong wrong wrong...my country is full of chavs, everyone drinks,,,well anyway your gonna have a laugh here mate,,,best of luck to you...
>> Anonymous
>>8609

bigot underage b&.

Ignore this fuckhead. He's one of the now very small working class minority who go about whining 'they took our jurbs...'
>> Anonymous
>>8355
You rotten traitor. In fact, TWICE A TRAITOR.
>> Anonymous
>>8418
Research is a good idea. As far as I know, Oxford is beautiful and has a great reputation, but it sounds really alien. I think you'd get the stereotypical english university experience going there, but not the most fun. The kids I knew who went there were rich, nerdy and pretty boring.
>>8413
I don't think changing university once you'd started would be possible at all. If you didn't care there could be spaces at universities that were desperate, but needless to say they wouldn't be very good. I had to drop out and apply again (losing a whole year) to change university. So get it right.
Plus, the language thing isn't really an issue. Having a basic grasp of something european would be useful if you wanted to travel, but not necessary. French might help when applying to Oxford though, and I think french is a more common second language in the UK than german (though I may be wrong).
I think if you're going to the UK you'd be a fool not to check out London, but it is really hectic and stressful to live in (in my experience.) But I know many people who go to university there who love it.
>> Anonymous
>>8789
OP here.

I've lived in suburbs my whole life, so, of course, I have an unquenchable desire to live in a big city one day. I've heard that London is a special type of awesome as a city, so I of course have a desire to at least be near London. If I go to school there, hey, great, that's good, too. I imagine it's both arrogant and foolish of me to think that I can make it in a big city right off the bat, but hey, I accept that I am both arrogant and foolish.
>> Cleotis
If you weren't a little of both (arrogant and foolish) you wouldn't be doing this mad plan in the first place <grin>. Keep in mind that your're used to continential distance and that the UK is a much more compact country. London by train from the Midlands is (or was) only 2 hours. I lived in The Smoke for 6 months and visited often. Its amazing, marvelous, and stresfu.