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Anonymous
good evening /p/

so i just got my rebel today. Im a beginning photographer, so i just wanted a beginner DSLR. Although i have toy'd around with some SLR's i am still very unsure about many of the controls (in b4 read the manual). i wanted to come to you /p/, whether you have a canon or not to help me out with some of my questions.

1.) can someone explain f-stop and aperture?
...im transfering from a point and shoot camera, so these topics were never a priority...

2.)for night shooting, or club shooting (with out a flash) what are good settings?

3.) & any other tips that can make my rebel shooting more successful and enjoyable.
>> Anonymous
1. Wikipedia them. That's how I, and probably at least 75% of photographers on here, learned.

2. The largest aperture (smallest f-number) possible, highest ISO you can live with the noise with. 1600 will be fine. Also, buy a faster lens (one with a larger maximum aperture). The 50mm f/1.8 is $80 and great, but a little long for many applications on a crop sensor, like the one in your Rebel. (Wikipedia "Focal Length") If you can afford it, buy a fixed focal length lens between 28 and 35mm and use that as your primary lens. (Somewhere in your reading you should stumble across the phrase "normal lens" or "normal prime." This is what I'm talking about.)

3. Learn photography. Read up on the working styles of different photographers, look at the work of great photographers and other visual artists.

A good place to look at really great documentary photography is the website of the Magnum Photos agency; more generalized photography can be found at a website called "Masters of Photography."

http://www.magnumphotos.com/
http://masters-of-photography.com/

Other good websites to learn about photography are the Luminous Landscape and David Alan Harvey's blog.

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/
http://davidalanharvey.com/
>> Anonymous
>>129097


thank you for taking the time
and responding
and thanks for the links
>> Anonymous
first tip
dont buy a 400d.

oh wait, too late.

Well, lets see now. If you can figure out how to change the aperture ( same as fstop ) on the annoying 1 e-dial control wheel......

the smaller the aperture ( the higher the number )

f2.8 is a wider aka faster aperture than f5.6
a wider aperture lets in more light, allowing you to use a lower iso setting so you dont get as much noise.

it also allows you to use a faster shutter speed

think of it like this

light = water

shutter speed is how long you turn the tap on
aperture is how wide your pipe is

in a club, you are going to need a wide, and super fast lens. im talking f 1.2 or 1.4

Clubs have very very dim lighting, and you dont want blurry images, therefore you will need to be shooting at at least 1/60th a sec with out flash. probally iso 1600 too.


Invest in a fast lens and a flash.
this will make your shooting much more fun.

or buy a nikon or pentax
>> Anonymous
Even your basic point and shoot camera has most of the same controls these days.

1) The aperture is just that, in your picture, the aperture is hexagonal opening where you can see the reflection of the photographer. F-stop is just the measurement of the aperture.

The lower the number, the larger the opening, the greater the amount of light, and the shallower the depth of field. For instance, f/2.4 lets in a lot of light, and gives you a very shallow depth of field, where f/16 lets in a little light, and gives you a wider depth of field.

So your two major exposure adjustments are aperture and shutter speed. The shutter speed controls motion in the image, and the aperture controls depth of field. When using a flash, 1/60th is the standard shutter speed, and you can really only control the exposure with the aperture.

The SLR will still have a fully automatic mode, P will give you some more control, but it mostly automated. Shutter priority lets you choose the shutter speed, and it will choose an aperture that gets the exposure correct. Aperture priority is the opposite. Manual relies on you to set both.

ISO will control exposure time as well, but the trade off for a higher ISO is more noise. Noise is bad, always IMO. It doesn't look nice like grain can. Keep it as low as you can in your situation, and try to not pass 400 if you want to be able to print larger pictures.

continued...
>> Anonymous
2) Outside at night, use a tripod when you can, but that won't be possible at a club. Bump the ISO up to at least 400 just so you don't get blurry shots. Open (lower number) the aperture as far as it will go, and try not to shoot below 1/60 without a tripod.

When you hold the camera, keep your arms in, close to your body. It will help you keep it more steady.

I bought a 50mm f/1.8 prime, I think it's ~$80 or less new, and it's great. It's a very fast (large aperture, allowing faster shutter speeds) lens that allows me to shoot with less light.

Try to never use the flash built into the camera, it sucks. Not that it's a problem with the Rebel, but any direct flash that close to the lens sucks.

Keep a lens or cap on the camera at all times. It sucks when the sensor gets dirty, but if it does, never touch it, just canned air or a blower.

That's all I can think of for now. Have fun.
>> Anonymous
>>129101
>>129100
>>129099

Shit, everyones imput really helped me, I feel like I'm starting to grasp the basics. Hopefully, I can bring some pics back soon for a progress report.
>> beethy !HJGkSBB3Ao
>>129097
>>129099
>>129100
>>129101
you guys are awesome, rarely do we see people go through so much trouble when giving advice to people on /p/
>> Anonymous
no probs

PS: get a flash, even something like a old school vivitar ....will do ( you might want a 430ex as you are new )

throw it on your camera, aim it at some random girl in a club, use a 3 second exposure - less if there is lots of lights around.


girl is sharp.......all the disco lights are blurred and streaking all over the show.

ps: the iso comment is bullshit.
as much as i dont like canon, their iso 800 is fine.
hell, if your shooting pics for the web, or even A4 size, iso 1600 should be ok.

in a club, auto focus might be a bit shitty, so manual focus, or use your AF assit beam on the exturnal flash that you will end up buying once you get addicted
>> Anonymous
>>129140
>in a club, auto focus might be a bit shitty, so manual focus

This is the big problem with the Rebel: It's viewfinder isn't good for manually focusing. IMO, manual focus is better, though, because it makes photographing a scene one continuous process: you're always adjusting the focus as everything moves, organically, whereas autofocus you either have to tell it which point to use or point the middle point at the subject for each shot and recompose. Breaks the flow. Lots of people disagree, though. Do what works best for you. Do try to do everything manually you feel personally comfortable with in a situation- anything to make you put more mental work into a photograph usually works out better, in the long run.

Maybe invest in a split-prism screen if you shoot in the dark alot or want to manually focus. It's a modification to your viewfinder that makes focusing easier. Here's a link to a popular and good company that makes them.

http://www.katzeyeoptics.com/cat--Canon-DSLRs--cat_canon.html
>> Anonymous
>>129099


>or buy a nikon or pentax

why
>> Anonymous
becouse, this is P and we must have brand wars, even if there is no need at all.

on a serious note.
d3 high iso preformance is fantastic.
>> Anonymous
successful thread is successful
>> Anonymous
Canon Rebels are fine for learning with, easy to use and the picture quality is ok. I havent experimented with different lenses yet though.
>> ac !!VPzQAxYPAMA
>>129177
>becouse, this is P and we must have brand wars, even if there is no need at all.
Not really. We're normally pretty good about that. I think there's a newfag pentaxfag who hasn't gotten acclimated yet...
>> Anonymous
Read Understanding Exposure by Bryan Peterson, no really.

If you're a cheap ass;

http://thepiratebay.org/tor/3899818/Bryan_Peterson_-_Understanding_Exposure_(Revised_Edition).pdf
>> Anonymous
>>129190

Actually, the picture quality on a Rebel is extremely good. ***D models have always used the same or nearly the same sensor as the **D series, and take the same lenses. Saying that a Rebel is a "good camera to learn on" it complete bullshit. Unless you are a studio photographer or photojournalist, you've got no need for anything the rebel doesn't offer.

I hate all the people talking about cameras like you need to have at least a certain amount of money invested, and a certain level of performance, for the camera to be useful. A good photographer will take a much better shot with a rebel or a PnS than someone who just got their dad to buy them a 1Ds.
>> Anonymous
>>129360
Anon knows his shit.

Someone using a 'basic' DSLR like a 400D/Rebel XTi but who knows how to get the most out of it and has genuine talent anyway > some clueless dipshit with a Hasselblad H2D-39.
>> Anonymous
>>129360
>Unless you are a studio photographer or photojournalist, you've got no need for anything the rebel doesn't offer.

1. Two control dials, spotmetering, and a good viewfinder are some pretty lacking things about the Rebel.
2. Studio photographers make perhaps the least demands on their camera, feature-wise, of almost anyone. They need a hotshoe, exposure controls (and one dial for all three of them would be fine in a studio), a tripod screw, and some way to frame the photograph. Doesn't even have to be especially accurate with digital where it can be reviewed afterwards. That's it. They don't even really need a focus system or a viewfinder decent for focusing, since they can focus by the DoF chart on their lens (if it isn't shit like most of them today) and they don't need a meter in the camera: with film, they need a flash meter, with digital, they can check their exposure afterwards on the histogram.
>> Anonymous
>>129371

1. I sometimes shoot with an Argus C3. It has no meter, and there are nine (9) steps to reset the camera for the next exposure. The viewfinder and rangefinder are in separate windows and each is the size of my smallest fingernail. A large viewfinder, spotmetering and two control dials would be nice, but they're hardly necessary to take pictures. Furthermore, given that most people with Rebels will be using AF lenses and don't know enough about metering to understand what a spot meter is good for, only the two control dials are really lacking. And that's not worth $600.
2. What I was referring to about studio photographers was things like advanced white balance correction, demand for maximum resolution (no, it isn't a demand of every type of photography), large and/or modular types of ground glass, and advanced flash metering.
>> Anonymous
When I'm in the studio, and anywhere I don't have to take a quick shot, I like to have tilt, shift, rise, fall, and swing as features of my camera.

I'm basically stuck with using an old camera and film, spending significantly more money than my car is worth, or renting something that would bankrupt me if anything happened to it.

Any studio photographer that says these aren't useful options probably doesn't know what they are.

A built in meter is effectively pointless in the studio.

All that aside, a studio photographer has significantly different needs than the OP. His XT will do everything he needs and then some. The resolution and image quality will let him print pretty large, even with cropping. He has a very nice list of lenses available.

I'm not a fan of digital, but I do agree that the XT does everything your average photographer needs.
>> Anonymous
OP Here again.

I'm going to be shooting a live show tonight at Philadelphia's Trocadero Theatre. The band memebers have been good friends of mine and are letting me do a little back/side stage photography. All your tips and help have givin me a much clear understanding of my settings, especially in dim light.

Keep posted for some pictures from the show. I'm looking forward to your imput.

And if your interested, here's the bands:
Www.myspace.com/adaytoremember
>> Anonymous
Which does what. With pictures. Dynamic.
>> Anonymous
http://www.dryreading.com/camera/index.html
>> Anonymous
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::sigh::

OP here, returning.

no good live shots, everything is blurred.

i'll i have to bring back is this

Camera-Specific Properties:Equipment MakeCanonCamera ModelCanon EOS DIGITAL REBEL XTOwner NamedSerial Number-874245319Image-Specific Properties:Horizontal Resolution72 dpiVertical Resolution72 dpiImage Created2008:02:25 07:19:17RenderingNormalExposure ModeAutoWhite BalanceManualScene Capture TypeStandardExposure Time1/2 secF-Numberf/5.6Exposure ProgramNormal ProgramISO Speed Rating1600Lens Aperturef/5.6Exposure Bias-2 EVMetering ModeAverageFlashNo Flash, CompulsoryFocal Length55.00 mmColor Space InformationsRGBImage Width2304Image Height3456Camera Actuations28
>> Anonymous
>>130327

It looks like you could really use a nice 50mm. The f/1.8 (~$80) would have let you shoot the same shot at 1/20th and the f/1.4 (~$300) would have made it 1/30th.
>> Anonymous
>>130331
...im listening.

is that what you use?
>> sv !!vC9KZM3Ch/H
>>130327

Shooting concerts, while I've never done it, I imagine you should: 1) keep the lens wide open 2) use spot or center-weighted metering 3) don't be afraid to max out your ISO

Your shot is blurry because it was exposed for half a second. Take your camera off auto and learn to control it, you'll get better results.
>> sv !!vC9KZM3Ch/H
And what>>130331said.

50mm f/1.8 is a cheap, fast, and great lens for either brand.
>> Anonymous
>>130333

I had the 50mm f/1.8 for all of 4 months before I sold it to a buddy and bought a 50mm f/1.4.

If your guitarist is moving too much, you are still in a lot of trouble. If he manages to remain relatively still for a few moments, 1/20th and 1/30th might do it.

You can also always hope for a venue with better lighting that will allow you to faster shutter speeds.
>> Anonymous
>>130336

i wasnt using auto when i took this? i was using manual. which is why im still tweaking some stuff, which is why this thread is here.

and this lighting just flat out sucked.
>> Anonymous
In addition to everything said above:

Don't be afraid to underexpose here. There's nothing interesting in the shadows, just stage, and your main concern isn't a nice-looking histogram, it's a photograph where everything isn't blurry.

The Canon 50/1.4 is a great lens, better in every regard than the 50/1.8.

Lastly, the most important thing for concert photography (and photography in general) is experience and skill, and the latter comes with experience. If you get your timing right, you can get a still shot. Practice manually focusing so the AF doesn't hunt on you when you want to take the shot. Or, get your camera on a tripod (do this anyway, you're a damned masochist if you're trying to handhold in these situations), get the focus on the performer at the mic or on the drums (someone that stays relatively still is the point), flick it to manual focus, and leave it there.
>> Anonymous
     File :-(, x)
>>130336

i wasnt using auto when i took this? i was using manual. which is why im still tweaking some stuff, which is why this thread is here.

and this lighting just flat out sucked.

i found i was happier with this greyscale, it downplayed a little of the iso grain , seemed to slow his movement down a bit

Camera-Specific Properties:Equipment MakeCanonCamera ModelCanon EOS DIGITAL REBEL XTOwner NamedSerial Number-874245319Image-Specific Properties:Horizontal Resolution72 dpiVertical Resolution72 dpiImage Created2008:02:24 23:39:45RenderingNormalExposure ModeAutoWhite BalanceManualScene Capture TypeStandardExposure Time1/2 secF-Numberf/5.6Exposure ProgramNormal ProgramISO Speed Rating1600Lens Aperturef/5.6Exposure Bias-2 EVMetering ModeAverageFlashNo Flash, CompulsoryFocal Length55.00 mmColor Space InformationsRGBImage Width2304Image Height3456Camera Actuations28
>> Anonymous
>>130350

Exposure Mode Auto
>> Anonymous
Not the OP, but asking for the OP: Can the focus on the XT be set to a separate button?
>> Anonymous
>>130350
>and this lighting just flat out sucked.

Welcome to the world of concert photography.

Does anyone know who the fucktard was that concluded music goes best with random flashing lights in otherwise absolute darkness?
>> Anonymous
>>130367

Probably some e-tard.
>> ac !!VPzQAxYPAMA
>>130347
>The Canon 50/1.4 is a great lens, better in every regard than the 50/1.8.
...except for price and weight.