File :-(, x, )
To continue the debate..pt1 Anonymous
To answer a few questions and keep the discussion going...

"Why doesn't anyone ever point out in these discussions that the Bible itself might just be a book that got so famous that someone made it his religion and the it spread?"

I believe in God/afterlife and say this often to those who take the Bible too literally. The Bible is a book with good principles and teachings but it IS a book. It is not divine scripture. God did not write it. It is not meant to be taken literally, it is not meant to be the cause of war, it is simply meant to be something which helps one start a spiritual journey.

"Then there is a followup question I've always wanted to ask; When people say that if you live a bad life or be an atheist, you go to hell, but if you believe in God and go to church every sunday you go to heaven, have they actually read the bible? If I recall right, it says that "God" gave his only son so everyone would be saved. Which means no ones going to hell."

That's right. No one is going to hell. Hell is a choice, not a consequence of divine judgement. If you realize you are suddenly in Hell then according to scripute all you need to do is ask God for forgiveness and BAM, you get transported to Heaven instantly. In theory, even the fallen themselves could get back in Heaven by doing the same thing, they just choose not to. People who claim to have spoken with angels through angelic magic say that the fallen say this themselves, that they choose not to be in God's light anymore.
>> pt 2 Anonymous
To put it simply...the hell myth is a result of immoral humans trying to use fear tactics to get the masses to convert to their religion. Once this conversion takes place the church has absolute control over it's members. The problem with church and religion in general is it's controlled by humans who are not divine/perfect, hence all the corruption. This is why I believe someone should find their own truth in life. Don't let the indiscretions of all these fanatics push you away from the spiritual side of life, find your own truth and meaning in things. Study life and try to find some kind of meaning to everything that makes you feel good on the inside.

That's what I think as someone who isn't a little puppet for organized religion. Never let any religion get in the way of your reason or logic. Never pick religion over science. However, until science is able to actually prove beyond all doubt that God doesn't exist...i'll continue believing in him because it makes me feel good on the inside.
>> Anonymous
Is this like porn dirty talk? If it is, then i approve this thread.
>> Anonymous
awesome
>> Anonymous
relying on belief of a deity and the afterlife in order to feel good is a crutch. people need to start accepting the world we live in at face value. sure, there's alot of bad and ugly things happening all the time, but we have the power within ourselves to make things better.
>> Anonymous
This is the most unchristian hippytalk bullshit I have ever read.

Jesus died to save the Jews, faggot. You gentile punks are doomed from the getgo.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
>> Anonymous
>>449647
>>449648
>>449725
The world is coming to an end. /b/ is saying something that doesn't involve atheistic asshatery OR fanatic faggotry. I have more hope for the world now then I have ever had ever.
>> Anonymous
>>449729

GFTO jew. Allah said all jews are going to hell. You're screwed, pal. Praise Allah.
>> Anonymous
>>449725
You misunderstand...it's not needed to make me feel good about life, it's needed to make me feel good about my afterlife. If there was no afterlife i'd probably be a lot less generous and a lot more of an unnecessary asshole. Not because i'm a bad person but because there would be no point in not putting myself first above all others. If this really is the only life I get and there is no judgement awaiting me...why would I even bother with charity when it does nothing but make my life a little harder?

I'm not discrediting the power within people, just saying it's nice to feel like life will continue even after death. That I can continue learning about the universe and all that good stuff. I think the concept of an afterlife is the reason why a lot of charities exist and why a lot of people help others when otherwise they wouldn't. Though i've met some really kind and giving atheists...even the fanatic religious people tended to give a lot more up for the good of their fellow man.

>>449649
If you want it to be, haha.

>>449729
Thanks, i'm not Christian and i'm happy to hear that all my efforts to avoid being in an organized religion haven't gone to waste.
>> bleh :P Anonymous
Why do people keep forgetting about that little meeting in Nicea between early catholic leaders(roman priests if memory serves me right) where they surgery sliced books out of the bible and burned most of those documents(the apocrypha are perhaps the bit that wasnt burned)These new bible scrolls they found that everyones so riled up about is one of them too although the name of them escaped me.

then again i might just be mumbling in an attempt to let the debate move along :P
>> Anonymous
>>449752
Book of Enoch comes to mind. It was once seen as legitimate scripture then suddenly one pope decided all of a sudden it was false scripture. Also every single thing Jesus had taught his disciples was also buried by the church.

Hint: Jesus didn't teach that religion should be forced upon people, wars started over it, etc etc. But because that doesn't fit in with the corrupt agenda of the church and it's members they buried the information. It got rediscovered though, as most important information usually does.
>> Anonymous
>>449752
Dead Sea Scrolls?
>> Anonymous
wtf is this doing in animated gif?
>> Anonymous
<-- /discussion/ is that way
>> Anonymous
lolwut?
>> Anonymous
topic's dumb like the bible.
>> Anonymous
CLEVER TROLL IS CLEVER
>> Anonymous
indeedily
>> Anonymous
>>449738
lol, you need rewards (going to heaven) to do nice things for people?

religious people are the most selfish fucks of all.
>> Anonymous
im in your gifs preaching about gods
>> mizuhoeatsyouforbreakfast
>>449647
sauce on the gif?
>> Anonymous
So, am i to understand that this thread is not about porn?
>> Anonymous
Might as well believe in afterlife, because you never know what till happen, nor can it ever be proven. I mean if their was no afterlife..then when you die.. how would you ever know? it's like you'll sleep or anything. for atheist, it;ll be the way you were brought into this world..which nobody can remember. most people only remember who they are up to when they are about 5 years old. so when you die, 1,0000 years could seem like 1 second.

blah what am i saying. nobody cannot even grasp the concept of death. there are too many questions and sadly they will never be answered.it just makes me mad that people are so stubborn that they try to prove all religion is fake who like are teenage kids who know nothing of both sides, let alone even probably read up on how to debate. silly rabbit, tricks are for kids.
>> Anonymous
All religions are crutches that humanity uses when they run out of excuses for their behavior.

The biggest poppycock ever (along with so much else about religion) is the view that it's good to be delusional if it means people get conned into being kinder.

Thread is megafail. Thread over.
>> Anonymous
Yes, but where are the images of big breasted anime girls?
>> Anonymous
>>450204
>>I mean if their was no afterlife..then when you die.. how would you ever know? it's like you'll sleep or anything

So you believe in something because it cannot be proven to not exist. You and about a couple of billion other morons like you need raptor jesus.
>> Anonymous
     File :-(, x)
gif related
>> Anonymous
>>450203
>>450191
>>450058
>>450051
>>450045
>>449838
>>449829
>>449734
>>449733
>>449729
>>449649
Can we please keep this discussion serious?

>>449647
I don't suppose you've actually read the Bible? When Jesus died to save everyone, it meant the choice was open to everyone. It was an option that was offered. You have to make the choice. And there is a Hell, and people will go there, as a consequence of one choice: whether or not they accepted Christ.

As for the matter of the religion being based on the Bible, the religion predates the Bible be about 2000 years, hence it is NOT based on the Bible.

>>449648
Christians want you (both in general and specifically) to accept Christ so that you won't go to Hell. There is no system of brownie points like you find with Jehovah's Witnesses. If you choose not to accept Christ, or choose to continue on in a fantasy world where no such choice needs to be made, go ahead. Just know that you were warned. And science will never disprove God's existence. It is incapable and inferior.

What are you basing your "theories" on? Some teachings that tell you what you want to hear? It was once said that "scripture taken out of context is a pretext to heresy." Here's the proof.
>> Fake is fake Anonymous
     File :-(, x)
"inferior" You pipe all that using it as we speak? What about all the killing God has done? Slicing open pregnant women and taking virgin girls as slaves? God sounds a major prick if he pushes for shit like that and slavery.

Hey guess what, I do read the Bible! Why? Just so I can ask about shit like this in other Christian groups, and what do I get? I get the equivalent of a "Deeeeeeergh?"

So when are you ready to stop believing in a guy that sits on a cloud?
>> Anonymous
>>449647

So, the bible is Catholic? Everyone's Catholic?
>> Anonymous
>>450320
There's a difference between "reading" the Bible and "interpreting" the Bible. Even so maybe you should re-read 449647 again. "The Bible is a book with good principles and teachings but it IS a book. It is not divine scripture. God did not write it. It is not meant to be taken literally..."
>> Anonymous
>>450316
Christianity didn't come first, I refuse to accept a religion that sends me to Hell for not accepting Christ when it came AFTER the religions it's based on.

Also, wouldn't this acceptance of Christ option be open at all points in time? Meaning if I was in Hell, I could simply accept Christ and BAM, beam me up God. There is not mention of eternal punishment in the Bible as a consequence for not following a religion. There is no mention of an irreversible damnation. Try reading the Bible sometime instead of letting biased priests with AGENDA'S tell you what to think.

Also try studying near death experiences, they support my theories more than they support christian theories of eternal irreversible damnation.
>> Anonymous
>>450320
About all the abortion and "clouds"... where is that?
Since "you read the Bible" you should have no problem pointing this out so I can look it up.
>> Anonymous
I WANT MAI 4CHAN BACK
>> Anonymous
>>450337
Christianity evolved from a sect of Judaism, which is probably the religion he was referring to, moron.
>> Anonymous
>>450342
Christ didn't fulfill all the prophecies and that is why Judaism is still separate from Christianity. Jewish people do not believe Christ to be the son of god(though they don't deny his good works) because he didn't fulfill all the prophecies. This led to christians(who did believe Jesus was the son of god) to come up with the false prophecy(made up afterwards) that Jesus was going to have a second coming in order to fulfill the original prophecy.

Because of all the ridiculousness in the entire situation between judaism and christianity...it's hard to believe that christianity is the one true path and that not believing in Christ is a ticket to eternal damnation with no atonement.
>> Anonymous
>>450189
I like this anon. On one hand I would agree with anon. But on the other hand anon insults nearly every person who follows a religion and acts all high and mighty. How can anon win and fail at the same time?
>> Anonymous
>>450337
Never listened to a priest. You see, I'm a CHRISTIAN, and you seem to have taken me for a CATHOLIC.

And no, you can't make the choice from Hell. Life is your one shot. After that, your time is up, your "window of opportunity," if you will. And that "I refuse to accept a religion like that" is your loss. If you're that dense, I won't waste anymore time on you. Family Guy is on, afterall.
>> Anonymous
>>450351
Isaiah 53. That is all.
>> Anonymous
>>450354
They discourage the reading of that chapter in Synagogues, and avoid it altogether during services.
>> Anonymous
>>450353
God knows people are ignorant. God knows that there is countless religions out there. God knows that people will sin and most likely refuse religion. God is willing to send billions of people to Hell with no chance for redemption after setting up a world full of misinformation and no true way of knowing which religion is right since they all claim you will suffer some form of eternal damnation if you don't convert.

Yeah, doesn't make sense. Furthermore, CHRISTIANITY IS NOT AVAILABLE EVERYWHERE SO DO THOSE PEOPLE GET ETERNAL DAMNATION TOO JUST BECAUSE THE BIBLE ISN'T AVAILABLE IN THEIR PART OF THE WORLD?

Your theory on this is flawed based on that single fact alone. You are saying that those with no chance to even convert to christianity because of it's lack of availability were also sent to Hell. That is a ludicrous statement at best.
>> Anonymous
>>450360
nope, they're covered by default. sorry to ruin your night.
>> Anonymous
>>450366
Care to provide a scripture that says this? I'd be happy to read evidence.
>> Anonymous
>>450360
God created other religions? No. He created people with free will. You have it, I have it, and, unfortunately, Anton LeVay and L. Ron Hubbard had it. If He'd wanted robots, he would have made robots, but he didn't.
>> Anonymous
>>450368
Nice try at irony. Proverbs 28:18. "Whoever is blameless..." read it yourself. I assume you're referring to some isolated tribe on an uncharted island or deep in the jungle? I know no one on 4chan will disagree with the statement that these people are likely simple minded and uncorrupted, right?
>> Anonymous
>>450369
Reading comprehension motherfucker, do you have it? I said he was aware of the existence of other religions and the confusion they would cause. It is unrealistic to assume people would be able to find reasonable evidence in which religion is "right" if only one were to be right.
>> Anonymous
>>449725
I may not have an M.D. at the end of my name, but I'm pretty sure someone with an imaginary crutch wouldn't get much use from it.

And God IS a crutch, in that we need him. Great analogy!
>> Anonymous
>>450371
I read the surrounding verses and it is speaking of punishment, not eternal damnation. Please provide proof that it is speaking of eternal damnation that is impossible to get out of even by asking forgiveness.

If you are a good Christian you will do all you can to convince me to convert lest the damnation of my soul be on the hands of your laziness.
>> Anonymous
>>450372
Writing comprehension. You said God set up a world full of misinformation. 4th sentence of 450360.

And as for the evidence that points to the right religion? I found it just fine. You must have glaucoma or something.
>> Enjoy your paganism Anonymous
"The traditional concept of Hell does NOT come from the inspired Hebrew or Greek manuscripts. It is a pagan myth adopted as Christian doctrine in the third century by church fathers. Yet, then as now, innocent people are taught the traditional concept of Hell by trusted authority figures. That trust deters questions, so for hundreds of years the myth has perpetuated. The KJV and other translations have also perpetuated the myth by less than the most accurate translation of the word Hell. But this is changing as seen in Table A."
>> Anonymous
>>450379
Against my better judgement, I'm informing you that I'm aware of your motives in challenging me. Based on this, I know that you won't change regardless of what I say. However, here goes:

It says "saved," not "let to live a good life." It is speaking of damnation.
>> The great question is.... Anonymous
"What is sin? Any thought, word, action, ommission , or desire contrary to the law of God.

What is Hell? Spiritually speaking, it is separation from God.

No one has to be separated from God. Jesus laid down His life on the cross so that we might be reunited with God. But we have to put our trust in Jesus. If we don't, we have no hope of getting to heaven. Ultimately, whether you go to heaven or hell is up to you. Where are you headed?"

The great question is why can't I just confess my sins directly to God? Why can't I just put my faith in God? Why can't I put my trust in God? Why do I have to go through a middleman named Jesus in order to pray for forgiveness from God? Furthermore, according to countless articles written by priests...the fact I recognize and pray for forgiveness for my sins means I am washed clean of said sins and thus worthy of being invited into the kingdom of Heaven. I haven't read a single line of scripture that explains why I must pray through Jesus when those who lived before Jesus could pray directly to the almighty himself. No priest or christian has ever explained this to me.
>> Anonymous
>>450386
Until I learn Hebrew I'll have to settle for the KJV (hmm... maybe the NKJV). Hell is separation from God. God is in heaven, God is on Earth, God is NOT in Hell. That is Hell. I don't necessarily believe in the fire or the brimstone, just the hopelessness of knowing there is no way back to God.

And the devil? he'll be down there getting tortured with the rest of 'em. Contrary to Paradise Lost, he is not the ruler of hell.
>> Anonymous
>>450392
NASB: He who walks blamelessly will be delivered, But he who is crooked will fall all at once. (NASB ©1995)
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GWT: Whoever lives honestly will be safe. Whoever lives dishonestly will fall all at once. (GOD'S WORD®)
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KJV: Whoso walketh uprightly shall be saved: but he that is perverse in his ways shall fall at once.
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ASV: Whoso walketh uprightly shall be delivered; But he that is perverse in his ways shall fall at once.
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BBE: He whose ways are upright will be safe, but sudden will be the fall of him whose ways are twisted.
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DBY: Whoso walketh in integrity shall be saved; but he that is perverted in his double ways, shall fall in one of them.
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JPS: Whoso walketh uprightly shall be saved; but he that is perverse in his ways shall fall at once.
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WBS: He who walketh uprightly shall be saved: but he that is perverse in his ways shall fall at once.
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WEB: Whoever walks blamelessly is kept safe; but one with perverse ways will fall suddenly.
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YLT: Whoso is walking uprightly is saved, And the perverted of ways falleth at once.

I still fail to see the evidence. Speak to me like a priest would, explain it in simple worlds while quoting exact scripture so I can see your interpretation in action.
>> Judaism's opinion on the matter seems much more likely... Anonymous
"Before entering the Garden of Eden, though, every soul must be refined, for it cannot enjoy the Divine Presence to the fullest degree with the pleasures and coarseness of our physical world still engraved on it. These would give the soul poor “reception” of divine radiance, and must be removed.

In order to restore the level of purity the soul had possessed before entering the physical world, it must undergo a degree of refinement commensurate to the degree which the body may have indulged itself. If a person sinned in this lifetime, as most of us do, then, to continue the radio analogy, we have serious interference. This means there is even more cleaning to be done. This cleaning process hurts, but is a spiritual and mental process designed not for retribution, but to allow one to truly enjoy his/her reward in Gan Eden. This cleaning process is called “Gehinom,” or, in the vernacular, “Hell.” "

Depending on the sin of the person...the process can most likely be excruciating. It may not be be eternal but it could definitely be considered "hell" to feel all the pain you caused the world and every single negative effect you had. This seems more likely than being cast out with no way of repenting.(Protip: Near death experiences verify this version of the afterlife, they do not verify christians versions of eternal damnation.)
>> Anonymous
The ideas of Heaven, Hell and the Devil are Near-Eastern mythologies adopted by the Israelites (aka Jews) while Israel was taken over by Babylon.

This later on became part of Christian teaching too since well, Christianity stems from Judaism.

WHY IS THIS CONVO GOING ON in /gif/?
>> AnonyMoose
Two things:

1: Happy Beltane!
2: Why the hell are you twits having this conversation in /gif?