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Anonymous
Sup mis/fit/s,

I've been wondering lately, I always thought that pushing to failure will logically, pack on more muscle and increase strength and so on.
But lately you guys on here are all "Do 5 sets of 5" "Only 3 to 7 reps MAX" and such.

So, what is the reasoning behind this? Surely going to failure seems to be the more practical approach, but I'm interested as to why most people do the other method.

Thanks.
>> Anonymous
you're supposed to be selecting a weight that will make you fail by the 5th or 7th rep, or however many you plan to do.
>> Anonymous
>>103976
I thought that was only on the last set, so "Do 5 sets of 5" still doesn't make sense to me.
>> Anonymous
>>103977
no, each set. the amount of weight may vary from set to set, in order for you to accomplish this. but each time, fail in the rep range.
>> Anonymous
If you consistently train to failure (i.e. doing one-rep maxes all the time) you will fry yourself out, lose strength and probably injure yourself.
>> Anonymous
1st Set 20kg (warmup)
2nd Set 40kg (mid set)
3rd Set 60kg
4th Set 65kg (heavy set)

Out of these, I usually only make 2-3 reps on the Heavy Set. So in other words, I 'build' the sets up rather than just jumping right onto the big numbers (and yeah, they may not be big numbers, but I only weigh 60kgs).

So what does this other method entail and how is it better at building muscle?
>> Anonymous
>>104000
You should include a 5th set of 20kg for the cool down rep but this is good.
>> Anonymous
What I basically want to know is, is my current routine resulting in Myofibrillar Hypertrophy or Sarcolplasmic Hypertrophy.

And which one do I want to make the biggest size gains (currently very slim, small gains can be seen, been at it for a fair few months).
>> Anonymous
Sarco hypertrophy occurs best around the 8-12 reps, around 3 sets. That's not including warm-up sets.

However, if you are just starting out you really should focus on strength training (5 reps, 3 to 5 sets) for the time being. I know you want to get bigger, but by building a good strength base you will be able to lift more weight later on when you want to swift to 8-12 reps. If you eat enough food, you will grow. I suggest you try to get more healthy calories into your body so you get size gains alongside strength gains.
>> Anonymous
>swift

switch*
>> Anonymous
>>104083
Alright then thanks, and what is the optimal resting time between those sets? I usually take about 1 minute to as much as 1 minute 30 if I spend too much time switching around plates.
>> Anonymous
>>104095
Longer than that. If you are doing 5x5 you can take around 3 to 5 minutes, maybe even more if you are really going at it hard (but you shouldnt go at it that hard every workout). A minute, or a minute and a half, won't be enough time to recover, so your next set will be lacking. At the moment I'm doing 3x5 with the same weight for each set so theres no plate swapping going on. I just stand up (better than sitting/laying down) and breathe, focus my mind, think about my form etc.
>> Anonymous
>>104098
Okay thanks for everything then!
>> Anonymous
>>104098

Speaking from personal experience, if you are a big guy starting out on 3x5, and you're working up gradually the way you should be, 3-5 minutes rest is not needed.
>> Anonymous
>>104215

agreed, i usually only take a minute, minute and a half at most when doing 3x5
>> Anonymous
>>104098
That's retarded. 2 min between sets max
>> Anonymous
>>104221
>>104217
>>104098

And this is why I asked. Because of this large conflicting approach to how much time you should wait.

Also, I'm no big guy, stats are:
19, Male
6', ~60kg
>> Anonymous
>>104098here

When I do heavy ass-to-grass squats, I need those 3 minutes - the first minute is mainly getting my heart rate down and the next 2 are to make sure my muscles are prepared. I don't want to sound like an internet tough guy because I'm actually around the OP's stats but shorter, but if you guys aren't feeling pretty knackered after a set of squats then you aren't doing squats properly :s
>> Anonymous
Just to clarify:

Do 5 sets, choosing enough weight that I can only do approximately 5 reps each, with 1-2 minutes rest between each, right?

This builds strength and mass (if eating enough), right?

Less weight and more reps leads to what then?
>> Anonymous
>>104231

Yeah when I do heavy squats 5x5, I tend to rest 2-3 minutes. However for deadlift, bench, flys, and overhead press its 2 minutes max.
>> Anonymous
>>104232
Can anyone confirm or correct this please? You're all much smarter than me and my roommate (who thinks he's smart, but can't even figure out Java).
>> Anonymous
>>104245
Are you lost?
>> Anonymous
>>104246
Nope, just looking for clarification. My roommate acts like he knows what he's talking about when it comes to working out, but according to you guys, he's wrong. I'm more inclinded to believe you since he's been blantantly wrong with other things on multiple occasions.

>>104232
was a summary of everything I've picked up in this thread, and I just want to make sure I'm getting everything right.

I'm not OP, just some guy that walked in today.
>> Anonymous
>>104247
Oh okay.

Heavier weights and less reps = bulk and mass
Lighter weights and more reps = conditioning and stamina
>> Anonymous
>>104248
Right, but are the numbers correct?
>> Anonymous
My routine is like this: 20 mins each on the treadmill, elliptical and bike. Then 2x12 bench press & shoulder press, hammer curls & overhead triceps extensions, 2x20 leg curls & press, 2x30 abdominal crunch (2x30 on an inclined bench & 2x30 using a machine) , 2x30 back extension. This is what the trainer at the gym prescribed me, i told him i want to focus on losing weight. It lasts about 2 hours, yet you say it should be an hour at most. Am i doing it wrong?
>> Anonymous
>>104249
Low reps, heavy weight would be 1-5 reps, mostly strength gains but if you eat enough you will see growth as well
Medium reps, medium weight would be around 8-12, focuses more on building muscle than becoming pound-for-pound stronger, as long as you eat enough
high reps low weight12-20 (don't go as high as twenty, 15 is usually tops) results in endurance gains and little or no mass.

----


>>104250

Do the weights routine first, you will get more out of it that way. Instead of leg curls and press, look into just doing squats. You could easily leave out the ab work and back extensions. See about adding deadlifts in there, or bent over rows, for the back. Basically all you need to do as a novice is: bench press, squats, deadlifts. Increase the weight, and decrease the reps, so instead of 2x12 bench press try something like 3x5. You want the weights section to last about an hour max.

As for the cardio, I would suggest trying to do it on a different day. So, weight training Mon Wed Fri; cardio Tue Thur and possibly Sat. Don't do anything on Sun. You don't need to do the variety of bike and running and elliptical in one session. With cardio you could either go the HIIT route, where you do a minute of really intense work (i.e. sprinting) and then a minute of gentle work (i.e. walking or jogging), repeat for 20 minutes, no more. Or you could do sustained low-medium effort (i.e. jog) for an hour or so. If you are really fat then I would recommend you use the elliptical and/or bike over running until you get down to a healthy weight (saves your joints)
>> Anonymous
>>104259
Forgot to say, if you can't manage the time to do cardio on a separate day, do it after weights and I would recommend the HIIT method to keep the time down. When you go over 1 hour working out your body goes into a catabolic mode which undermines the whole point of anabolic weight training.


Oh and also, none of this means shit if you have bad nutrition.
>> Anonymous
Ugh, i have no idea how to achieve good nutrition. Can't someone tell me simple kinds of food i can eat to ensure good nutrition? No supplements and such shit.
>> Anonymous
>>104264
Good proteins:
Chicken (Also I think Turkey is good?)
Egg (Some people are scared of the yolks, but you can decide if you wanna take them out yourself)
Fish
Various beans etc

Bad protein:
Red meat - avoid steaks etc. Some lean red meat is alright once in a while, but it's easier to stick to the good proteins.

Good carbs:
Whole bread
Whole pasta
Fresh fruit and vegetables
Oatmeal

Bad carbs:
Non-whole pasta
White bread
etc

Good fats come from stuff like fish etc, bad fats from red meat etc


Eat the good stuff, avoid the bad. Drink plenty of water. Drink no soda, not even diet soda. Try not to drink alcohol. Avoid candy/chocolate. It's OK to have a treat once in a while as a reward for eating well, but you should limit yourself rather than going on a binge.

If you are serious about losing weight you should really research more into proper nutrition, because I've only done the very basics and know I've missed a lot out.
>> Anonymous
>>104250
OP Here, I don't think so.

You are aiming for weight loss, so you are doing everything right as far as I can see, you're not going for mass unlike myself. Besides, most of your routine is cardio where as I have none, just pure lifting.

You're doing it right.
>> Anonymous
>>104268
Thanks, i just don't know how to eat smaller portions every 2-3 hours a day instead of whole big meals and still eat healthy combos (right amount of carbs, proteins and fat?).
>> Anonymous
>>104273
You could cook something up in the morning or whenever and put it into single serving plastic containers. Then you don't have to cook a meal every few hours, maybe just need to reheat something.

Go to some more bodybuilder-orientated sites (what I mean is, a site dedicated to weightlifting rather than a *chan board) and they should have a whole bunch of recipes. You're going to have to do the legwork on the research.
>> Anonymous
I DUNZ RED REPLIZ

7) Don't Always Train to Failure

It's ingrained in many of us that, sans a warm-up or two, if you're going to pick up a weight, you're going to lift it until you can't lift it anymore. After all, that's the way a Testosterone Nation man should train, right?

Not necessarily.

If you're going to train to failure you're going to have to severely limit the number of sets you do in order decrease your chance of overtraining. While training to failure for a limited number of sets can work (a la Max OT Training, DC Training, and Heavy Duty Training) it's a lot easier, probably safer, and just as effective to stop a rep or two short of failure. I know I've made my best gains in strength when training to just short of failure.

If it's scientific studies you're interested in, a recent study showed that training to failure led to hormonal signs of overtraining. Yet another study showed that only training to failure on the last of three sets was more effective than training to failure on all three sets.

Like Lee Haney said, "You should stimulate, not annihilate the muscle."

THIS is from the lastest T-Nation article on BODYBUILDING from a bodybuilder. Food for thought on BODYBUILDING.
>> Anonymous
>>104282cont'd

Anyways, 5x5 is a strength scheme. If you are doing curls than you're already fucking up, 5x5 is based on compound movements like the deadlift, benchpress, the jerk, squats, that shit (with heavy weight for all sets). 5x5 is fucking plenty to stimulate the shit out of your body IF YOURE USING COMPOUND MOVEMENTS WITH HEAVY WEIGHT. Heavy is relative but either way, you shouldn't fail every set (or any imo) and you shouldn't strive to fail. You should strive to fucking lift heavy shit not get crushed by it (so why would failing be the logical approach to succeeding). If you want to do curls or whatever, just do it with a 8-12 fucking 4 set bodybuilding scheme. Curls are kind of LOL imo because they have little carry over to any functional aspect other than curling.