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Fighting forms/Martial Arts Anonymous
So I'm curious, compared to other methods of fighting, how exactly does karate stack up? I constantly hear people go on about how 'so and so is a black belt," but i remember on another forum i frequent which has a huge MMA/pride fanbase that karate isnt as effective as alot of other techniques.
>> Anonymous
karate has just evolved into more of an art form than it is effective, especially since MMA blew up. how can you kick someones ass when your being ground pounded, then choked out?
>> Anonymous
>>80094
actually Karate has evolved into MMA.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01_kQd8pOus

Daido Juku = win
>> Anonymous
It comes down to the teacher and how they teach karate. Kata is an important part of training but it isn't everything. There should be sparring exercises that are realistic, strategy development, conditioning(bones, muscle, power, speed, flexibility), and breaking down and practicing the applications of the movements in the kata in a realistic way(bunkai). Stay away from places that have an emphasis on board breaking and doing only kata all the time(also stay away from places that have crappy ass sword and weapons defense, karate is mostly good for pure hand to hand). Eventually there should be actual live sparring.
Karate can stack up well as long as you train realistically, meaning to fight an actual life or death fight and survive it. Some karate guys can really fuck a person's shit up, most karate people I could defeat with a single well placed mawashi-geri(roundhouse kick)to the lower leg.
>> Anonymous
>>80094
so taking that in mind with

>>80095

what would you say about alot of the kids picking up karate when theyre young and carrying on till highschool? Example being my friend who constantly goes on about how great his kicks are.
>> Anonymous
>>80104

guess>>80098

kinda answered my question.
>> Anonymous
Kyokushin karate is pretty badass.
>> Anonymous
>>80104
it really depends on what branch of karate you pick up.
daido juku/kudo is the best imo. the next best is kyokushin.
>> Anonymous
As with any martial art or "self defense" you really have to give it ample amounts of leeway. Some arts are best for just building confidence, other are sport focused, and some focus on "realistic fighting techniques." They all have their pros and cons, just realize that in a self defense scenario, having quick wits, good conversational skills, a weapon, or fast legs will be much more important then a black belt in Kung Fu San Soo.
>> Anonymous
>>80095
Wow, Karate + Judo, what a fearful combination.

I was brown belt in shotokan and 7th kyu (orange belt) in Shito-ryu (left karate for 6 years, started again recently). And believe me, karate can be effective.
>> Anonymous
>>80164
Troll.
>> Anonymous
>>80170
Why?
I'm 80164 and I really think that karate blows and judo throws can fuck shit up. I have a friend whose Uchi Mata is really intimidating.
>> Anonymous
I practiced kenpo karate for four years as a child and I must say, while it was a great workout, it was very ineffective. Perhaps it just wasn't suited to me or perhaps I didn't practice it long enough (all of the sensei there were pretty good fighters) but I found it to be utterly useless in a match against an intelligent fighter.
>> Anonymous
OP here again, wasnt considering karate but can anyone then suggest a good form of martial art/fighting form to pick up for a complete newbie?
>> Anonymous
there are a bajillion styles of karate and you're all a bunch of homos.
>> Anonymous
JAP SHIT
SAGE
>> Anonymous
>>80235
muay thai, mixed with brazillian jiu jitsu and krav maga.
>> Anonymous
MMA is shit. Stay away.

Try muay thai, judo or tkd
>> Anonymous
>>80244
no to Krav Maga, thats just a bunch of Jewish Lies , another form of bullshido, charging huge bucks for just a short amount of time, but i agree on the BJJ and Muay Thai kickboxing, those are, probably the CORE essentials of MMA, but if you want to improve even further, study judo for takedowns, greco-roman wrestling for no-gi pins/holds
>> Anonymous
Whatever combination of things they teach in the Marines seems to be pretty useful.
>> Anonymous
I work out 2 hours a day, run cross country, and kickbox on my own time.

I know some skinny, weak motherfuckers that are black belts in various martial arts. All of them seem to think that passing a few tests that are more related to memorization than actual physical conditioning makes them a good fighter.

I did Tae Kwon Do in middle school and got to a green belt and quit. I was a skinny, weak kid at the time. All I had to do was take those damn tests and pass. I quit because I realized it was useless.

I've fought a few kids that were the highest belts in shit like Tae Kwon Do, Karate, and Judo and beat all of their asses with ease.

TLDR: martial arts training =/= real world usefulness
>> Anonymous
>>80292
Yeah, this. I actually think when your taught like this, you become cocky and overconfident, and are likely to get your ass handed to you even by fighting when you should run.
>> Anonymous
Karate sucks. WTF would you want to punch somebody while they can still punch you back? Take them to the ground first, and then start punching. Even your average untrained street thug understands this.
>> Anonymous
Some techniques of judo cam from karate takedowns. And yes strength is important in karate. Gotta love doing iron shirt exercises and using okinawan weights. My own karate workout has me doing some cardio punch block kick combos, sanchin(spend about an hour on sanchin a day), pushups both normal and on my fingers, about 50 squats with a 30 pound backpack on, kote kitae against wooden poles, makiwara work, sparring exercises, lots of stretching, and then maybe work on some higher kata. But yeah without strength building exercises you will probably get hurt hitting someone, and you will definitely get hurt if someone who knows what they are doing hits you.
>> Anonymous
>>80316

Thank you.

I'm glad someone who seems to be training in the more traditional style has spoken. Many American dojo will just teach you watered-down BS, but if you can find someone to teach you traditional, old school Okinawan karate, you're very lucky. Unfortunately, teachers like this are somewhat rare in the US to my knowledge.
>> Anonymous
>>80316

No, judo techniques came from jiujitsu and some wrestling, that Kano then refined, and has evolved, probably away from what Kano would've wanted.

But to answer the OP, karate can be good, if you can find a place that isn't some belt-factory McDojo, ie 99% of the schools in America. You can either go in and see how much sparring they do, or just find a good Boxing/Muay Thai/Other Ring sport school in your area.
>> Anonymous
>>80312
and while you are on the ground with him, his friends are kicking you in the head
>> Anonymous
>>80350
Jigoro Kano did go to Okinawa to study some of the takedowns and throws used in karate. It is something that Jigoro Kano himself has stated.
>> Anonymous
>>80250
Thats the dumbest shit I've ever heard. Especially when I saw
>tkd

Tae Kwon Do has become a fucking McDojo. I became a black belt in it when I was 11 (see how easy that is) and believe me I hardly picked up anything that could transition into a real fight.

Muay Thai + Jujitsu = win

Budoshin or Brazilian for Jujitsu.
>> Anonymous
>>80121

Anon speaks the truth, Kyokushin is hardcore, the rest are useless.
>> Anonymous
OP, it just depends on the fighter and how well rounded. Karate has some useless shit, but when teenagers fight, their skill levels are so low that whatever martial art they do don't really matter and it depends on their finesse.

And people don't really understand what MMA is. It's simply learning a number of martial arts and then using whatever you find is the most efficient from each.

Oh, by the way, TKD is the shittiest martial art.
>> Anonymous
>>80418
the only thing i don't like about it is the no punches to the face while sparring. people get the habit of not putting their hands up.
>> Anonymous
>>80418

hmm no
there's not only kyokushin and shotokan (shitty unpowered hit, olympics karate)

there's tons of really hardcore karate style
there's one (complicated name, forgot it :-s ) you learn stand up technic, throw and submission
it's without glove, the fighter are wearing gi and a weird helmet .. looking a bit like an escrime helmet
it's really hardcore also
>> Anonymous
>>80425
Fucking read the thread.
>>80095
>> sage
>>80250

That is the dumbest advice I've ever seen. Stay away from MMA? But go for TKD?

TKD will get laid on the floor, cornholed by MMA.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=D6mMtHqXyYc
>> Anonymous
>>80444

Yes, this one YouTube video is indisputable evidence of what would happen in any and all contests between TKD and MMA fighters.

Here's a thought. Turn off Spike and do some research into the real martial art. I'm not a huge TKD supporter, but I know enough that someone trained in the traditional art could handle himself or herself in a contest against a bulldog like this guy.
>> Anonymous
>>80444
The MMA guy fucking sucked himself. He couldn't pass that shitty guard, if you could call it a guard, and had multiple opportunities to go for a choke or an arm. Instead he just muscles the guy out.

That doesn't change the fact though that MMA > TKD
>> Anonymous
Depends what you want OP. There's sport fighting, and then there's military combat/street fighting. MMA is superior for one-on-one encounters, and pretty much nothing else. Modern military and street self-defense MA's are the best at preparing you how to end fights quickly enought and to GTFO out of there.
>> Anonymous
>>80651

Fuck you, MMA is far superior than any 'combat' martial art. They all lose in round 1 in the cage.
>> Anonymous
Krav Maga rapes the shit out of anything in a REAL fight.
>> Anonymous
>>80711
BWAHAHAHAHAA
>> Anonymous
>>80711

Cage fighting is as real as it gets.
>> Anonymous
>>80714
no one gets in a cage fight on the street PUNK
>> Anonymous
>>80716

Then define a street fight. Oh thats right. It has no rules, JUST LIKE A CAGE FIGHT, funboy.
>> Anonymous
>>80704

Yeah, "in the cage" which isn't real fighting. Its tournament fighting. No punches to the back of the head, no kicking while they're on the ground, no eye gounging, etc.
>> Anonymous
I know Krav Maga.. and it's meh.
My respect for Muay Tai grows every day. Even though it's not about what art you know, it's how much you spar/condition/practice.
>> Anonymous
>>80718

A street fight is where I bring a pistol and 5 of my boys. But you don't know that until after I sucker punch you.
>> Anonymous
krav maga = wimmenz self-defense

sorry, but krav maga sucks ass. mma has EVERYTHING on it.better strikes. better grappling. better form. better everything. wat does krav maga have? eye gouges? groin hits? fleeing? that is how women fight. guess what km teaches you to do? exactly just that. also, a striker has better chance at a groin hit and a grappler has a better chance @ an eye gouge.

krav maga = bullshido


MMA has its roots in boxing, MMA, kickboxing, wrestlnig and judo, which are all good sports for street apllicaitons
>> Anonymous
>>80732

Except it doesn't teach you situational awareness, how to handle multiple people so you can run, and it doesn't teach you weapon defense. The streets aren't fair.
>> Anonymous
>>80735
situational awareness? it's a toss up. you always have to be aware!

as for multiple opponents, that's BS. strikers have a way better chance at fighting multiple opponents. a MT guy in my city knocked out 3 bouncers in a club. theres also that video video of a boxer taking on 10 people.

for weapon defense, gl with that. most knife defense classes or demos are done slowed down, staged, and most of the defenses are ineffective. funny enough, the most useful defense techniques are dealin with overhead knife attacks, but lets be serious, no one overhead stabs
>> Anonymous
The best self defense is conversational skills and running.
>> Anonymous
>>80742

Bas Rutten had this series of videos on situational self defense for out on the street, in the bars, etc. Was pretty entertaining, the guy's a fking nutjob. you can probably find it on youtube still.
>> Anonymous
muay thai and ju jitsu with wrestling is the best any mma
>> Anonymous
MMA is for uncultured wannabes. Fighting isn't a sport or an art, its for killing and crippling people. If you want to prove a point, we have something call 'language'. If you want to compete at something, there are a myriad of sports out there.
>> Anonymous
>>80802
kill yourself.
>> Anonymous
>>80802
actually, i suggest he insult some gangsters and then see how well they use words
>> Anonymous
>>80834

That's not an effective use of words, buddy. If you have any amount of intelligence like I do, you'd stay away from the nigger ghettos. Why would anyone want to associate with them, I don't know.
>> Anonymous
>>80802
lol hippies.
>> Anonymous
>>80848
>nigger ghettos.
and you consider yourself to be a worthwhile human being don't you... you are a fucking worthless pussy
>> Anonymous
>>80855

NIGGER ALERT
>> Anonymous
>>80859

i'm a whitey, dumbass... if you are afraid to walk somewhere in your own city, you are a fucking worthless piece of shit
>> Anonymous
>>80863

Be my guest if you want to walk through the ghetto, nigger lover.
>> Anonymous
     File :-(, x)
>>80863

HAR HAR HAR.
>> Anonymous
>>80870
actually, Tucson and Phoenix don't have any "nigger gangs" we have mexicans/chicanos (no not illegals, the legal ones are the gangsters, illegals drive slowly, talk courteously (if they know english), etc.)

and i walk wherever the fuck i want.
PROTIP - muggings are really fuckinng rare, and even most violent criminals won't do something *randomly*... also, i know how to fight, and spar (no rules, except obviously nothing lethal or permanent) regularly with some friends.

you sir, are a sally, a faggot, a racist, or a troll (or a combination thereof)
>> Anonymous
>>80888
and i've talked with guys that look a fuckton of a lot scarier than that (they ended up being generally ok)

however, there's this wierd fuck who hangs around the university (goes by Koji, tells no one his real name) who likes stalking random people who may or may not have given him money (he's homeless and a leech)... he's the only person i'm mildly afraid of, because i don't always notice him before he notices me
>> Anonymous
>>80893

Ooh, tough guy measures dick length by areas he can walk. What a faggot. You probably live in an emo village, where all the spics are nice and won't mug you. Southeast DC = do not go if you aren't black. How stupid do you have to be to walk in a dangerous neighborhood where you aren't welcome.
>> Anonymous
>>80920
>just passing through

i have been places where i'm not wanted, if there is no legal reason for me not to be somewhere and i want to be there, i'll be there

also, have you fucking heard of CCW, you fucking pussy
>> Anonymous
>>80930
also, i can evade a car on foot in residential areas, so that helps
>> Anonymous
>>80718

Cage rules:

1. Butting with the head.
2. Eye gouging of any kind.
3. Biting.
4. Hair pulling.
5. Fish hooking.
6. Groin attacks of any kind.
7. Putting a finger into any orifice or into any cut or laceration on an opponent. (see Gouging)
8. Small joint manipulation.
9. Striking to the spine or the back of the head. (see Rabbit punch)
10. Striking downward using the point of the elbow. (see Elbow (strike))
11. Throat strikes of any kind, including, without limitation, grabbing the trachea.
12. Clawing, pinching or twisting the flesh.
13. Grabbing the clavicle.
14. Kicking the head of a grounded opponent.
15. Kneeing the head of a grounded opponent.
16. Stomping a grounded opponent.
17. Kicking to the kidney with the heel.
18. Spiking an opponent to the canvas on his head or neck. (see piledriver)
19. Throwing an opponent out of the ring or fenced area.
20. Holding the shorts or gloves of an opponent.
21. Spitting at an opponent.
22. Engaging in unsportsmanlike conduct that causes an injury to an opponent.
23. Holding the ropes or the fence.
24. Using abusive language in the ring or fenced area.
25. Attacking an opponent on or during the break.
26. Attacking an opponent who is under the care of the referee.
27. Attacking an opponent after the bell (horn) has sounded the end of a round.
28. Flagrantly disregarding the instructions of the referee.
29. Timidity, including, without limitation, avoiding contact with an opponent, intentionally or consistently dropping the mouthpiece or faking an injury.
30. Interference by the corner.
31. Throwing in the towel during competition.

Any form of martial art designed for civilian use and trained by civilians is fucking rubbish.

>>80732
The original Israeli military version of Krav Maga was focused on killing as fast as possible, whereas the housewife version nowadays is a pathetic civilian spin-off.
>> Anonymous
     File :-(, x)
>you sir, are a sally, a faggot, a racist, or a troll (or a combination thereof)

call it
>> Anonymous
>>80930

Lol Internet Tough Guy, I can tell you obviously have never been in a dangerous situation in your life by the way you talk.
>> Anonymous
>>80933

>The original Israeli military version of Krav Maga was focused on killing as fast as possible

Thats the only kind of fighting that is acceptable to learn. Killing people as fast as you can.
>> Anonymous
>>80940
actually, i've had someone hold me up to a wall and threaten my life
>> Anonymous
>>80945

I'm sorry that they didn't follow through.
>> Anonymous
>>80950
i didn't give him the opportunity
>> Anonymous
Oh yes, and the bullshit of TKD teaches you how to defend against the streets better than MMA.

By definition, MMA includes all MAs, it just so happens that the practioners of MMA tend to use the more useful aspects (like wrestling and kickboxing) rather than the more useless and shitty aspects of martial arts (like Tae kwon do or Kung fu).

And here's another TKD punk getting owned:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbrYiy3Xe_A

Here's another TKD fighter, getting owned by Muay Thai, to no one's surprise. That's what happens when you go against a real martial art.
>> Anonymous
>>80956

Link for that is here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CaVnwNaUBjM
>> Anonymous
>>80956

Tae kwon do is pretty bad ass when they don't train like faggots. Lol which is almost never the case. Korean military TKD is brutal I hear.
>> Anonymous
>>80955

I know why, because you sucked his cock you fucking faggot.
>> Anonymous
actually, i introduced his cock to my knee
>> Anonymous
>>80967

Still don't change that you're a faggot.
>> Anonymous
>>80976
hmmm... can't counter this because I can honestly say i wouldn't turn down gay sex... however, i am more interested in women than men

also, you didn't call it
>> Anonymous
>>80980
fail comeback
>> Vul !!e95V2fmCESS
>>80980
>>80988

Why don't you two love birds meet up somewhere and tickle each other's balls and then paint each other's toenails, you can continue discussing your adventures of street experiences in your own privacy
>> Anonymous
This thread is full of aids and fail
>> Anonymous
>>80992

I don't have street experience, because I'm not a retard that walks into danger like that other idiot, Vul.
>> Anonymous
Martial art faggots are all short poser fucktards with a Napoleon Complex.
>> Anonymous
JKD-fag here. It's not the style that's important. What is important is the fighter.
>> Anonymous
>>80998
that wasn't street experience, that was a coworker... i've never been attacked on the street

tl;dr - get you're young yuppy ass off my 4chan
>> Anonymous
>>81003
this
>> Anonymous
>>81003
i was under the impression that jkd was not a formally trained art... more a philosophical classification of badassery
>> Anonymous
>>81004

You're such a fucking faggot, bullshitting you're from the phoenix streets.

And who the hell types tl;dr for one line.
>> Anonymous
>>81012
i am from phoenix, i don't have a car, so i walk... no one bothers me because i don't bother anyone... get it through your fucking head you jew motherfucker

also, *I* type tl;dr for one line
>> Anonymous
>>81012
also, south phoenix isn't really as dangerous as it's made out to be, more violent crimes happen in central phoenix (the place with all the rich professionals and well lit streets)
>> Anonymous
>>81014

God fucking dammit nigger lover why won't you shut up
>> Anonymous
If you wanna be able to deal with knives or other close range weapons, screw martial arts and take fencing and carry a walking staff wherever you go. Fencing emphasizes quickness and precision over strength, so you should easily be able to defeat one knife wielder. However, you need to get yourself into a doorway or some other way to limit your opponents because you need room to operate as a fencer and dealing with more than one opponent is very tough at best. A doorway of some kind also limits the ability of your enemies to shoot you without hurting their buddies. A well placed lunge, even with a wooden staff, can easily knock someone out of a fight simply by knocking the wind out of them and/or breaking ribs, arms, toes, etc...

Also, since you typically wear lots of protective gear, you can attack anywhere on the body and be ready for similar attacks. You just might become cocky, which is always dangerous.
>> Anonymous
>>81023

Fencing is a western martial art.
>> Anonymous
>>81020
because it pisses you off, jew
>> Anonymous
>>81023
it also emphasizes the importance of NEVER being hit, and is thus even more awesome
>> Anonymous
>>81025

Nigger, I'm going to bed. As soon as I wake up, I'm going to find this thread so I can call you a fucking nigger again. Nigger.
>> Anonymous
>>81029
whatever you say, jew
>> Anonymous
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fL9ZXos8LfQ&feature=related
TKD v muay thai

of course I could find a vid of a thai boxer beating a tkd fighter

The amount of time you put into learning and training and the amount of fighting experience you have that will make you effective.

No style is better than another.

But all styles are better than MMA
>> Anonymous
>>81080
i agreed with most of it... then i got to the last line... and from nowhere: RAAAAAAAAAAGE
have you perhaps picked up on the fact that MMA IS IN FACT A MIXTURE OF VARIOUS STRONG POINTS FROM SEVERAL DIFFERENT STYLES?
and i don't even like MMA... what the fuck, how retarded are you?
that's like saying "no dairy products is better than another, but all dairy products are superior to cheese". (in that you also don't take into account that there are different types of MMA as there are different types of cheese)
>> Anonymous
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>>81121
oops, forgot to add my pic
>> Anonymous
If you really want to fight and win, go train MMA. Most cities have multiple MMA gyms now which teach both striking/kicking and BJJ.

The traditional martial arts generally fail at Novice through to upper medium expert range because of the focus on form and technique. Someone training in a basic striking/Ground pound MMA will be able to take most same level training "Traditional" martial artists. But, the difference comes into play after years and years of practicing those forms, while an MMA fighter who started with basic striking and BJJ will be good, a traditional martial arts master will usually be able to destroy them with speed balance intuition and technique. Though I'm sure you will have all seen grandmasters of certain Martial arts enter an MMA ring and just get taken down and continuously punched in the face. In conclusion, BJJ/Striking FTFW.
>> Moo !XBOXgikTFw
If you want to fight, learn boxing, if you want to defend yourself, learn fencing and carry a walking stick. If you want to win, get a gun. All this martial art shit is just ballet in flappier clothes.
>> ­
Asians invented martial arts because they didn't have guns.
>> Anonymous
Fencing is crap on the streets unless you have an actual sword, foil or asp baton. The other person might be able to grab the stick or stop a thrust, or avoid the thrust and grab your stick. Or just plain break it. Also fencing at least olympic stuff wont teach you street defense in a smart way, like hitting the knees, hands, temple, ankle, throat, or crotch.

Also aikido and jiujitsu teach good knife defense.
>> Anonymous
>>81319
Aikido and jiujitsu teach bullshit fake knife defense with slow attacks from cooperative opponents.
>> Anonymous
look, if you want to learn how to fight in a way that will actually be effective/whatever and don't want to hunt down the 1 karate dojo in america that teaches "the true krotty", just go find a boxing gym.
>> Anonymous
PROTIP: Read this post.>>81338
>> Anonymous
forgot learning how to fight, I'd say join judo or juijitsu and learn how fighting works. although boxing teaches you how to punch it's not the most realistic to base a fighting style off of.
>> Anonymous
IF you really want to learn how to fight, go out into a city in the evenings and pick fights with people. Anything else is just oriental dancing.
>> Anonymous
mma has made the world forget real fighting is a 1 hit process like when a WILD animal attacks another WILD animal with intent to kill.

eyes/throat and even a 12 year old girl can kill ANY man by striking those 2 body parts.

No martial art matters in a REAL FIGHT because no throws, take downs, kicks, punches, or any other bullshit matters in you cant see/breathe.

End of story, DONE.

kickboxing, boxing, wrestling, bjj, muay thai ALL OF IT IS SPORT. A GAME.

Real combat isnt some crap you walk away from after losing.

You die if you lose in real combat.

So, if you know ANY FIGHTER WITHOUT A PERFECT RECORD that means he isnt really fighting. He is participating in a sport or game with rules.

Its just not combat, its a sport.

With that said, the best martial art for self defense overall is just being physically fit enough to outrun your opponent. If he cant touch you, he cant hurt you.
>> Anonymous
>>80075
Okinawan Karate is the real deal, every other Karate is shit, btw JKD practitioner here
>> Anonymous
     File :-(, x)
>>81003
HIS INFLUENCE RESONATES TODAY
>> Anonymous
Karate isn't a technique. And just learning the punches and kicks and blocks and shit like that isn't Karate.

As for the various kinds of MMA, it's just a bloodsport. Think about it. There's rules: no weapons, no eye gouging, no headbutting, no fingerlocks, and they have penalties for not being aggressive. This divorces it entirely from "real" fighting, and makes it only useful as a benchmark between those styles of martial arts that don't use weapons, headbutts, finger locking, eye gouging, or initiative tricks.

Do not confuse MMA with actual no-rules fighting between people.
>> Anonymous
Karate is taking those techniques and movements and making them powerful, fast instinctive, multi-use, and part of a strategy, part of your being. Your soul goes into every technique, it has to, or you lose. Karate is about taking fighting theories and making them reality.

Real karate is systematic, as the body itself is systematic. Using karate as a reference and especially the principles of sanchin, kiba-dachi, nekoashi-dachi, and zenkutsu-dachi as a reference you can come up with anything you can imagine. An important thing though is to combine stuff in your training that would otherwise be seperate into something that can be meaningful, making your own fighting strategies and combinations, exploring how your footwork acts in conjunction with your opponent and your blocking and attacking, learning your balance and your opponents balance. Learning how your body routes power. Learning to survey everything in your peripheral vision and not to focus on one thing.

Karate training is somewhat like the sentence of my last paragraph, you can't keep your eye on only one thing, you may focus in on a few particular things but all those other things still matter and if you don't use your peripheral vision to see those things in your training you could fail when you really have to defend yourself.

I will say however that it is also important for karate practitioners to observe other martial artists as well because you might just come up against someone who does something so differently that you freeze up because you have no idea of how to deal with what they are doing.
>> Anonymous
if you want to kill people then start a gang and arm everyone with ak-47s. fuck martial arts.
>> Anonymous
>>81004
you're a faggot
gtfo fit you fat piece of shit
>> krm
Karate kids always give me shit when I say that I prefer Kung Fu. I've done both, although only for a few months each. Even though it was a short time, I learned more useful techniques from Kung Fu than I did from Karate.
>> Anonymous
This horse shit belongs in /k/.

Unless you're discussing getting in shape using martial arts, shut the fuck up. /fit/ is not about fighting people.
>> Anonymous
     File :-(, x)
>>82012
>> Anonymous
>>81764
It's a lot easier to win using "dirty" tactics (headbutts, eyegouges, groin strikes) if you can win using "legit" tactics. It says a lot about karate if the only way you can win is only via the ball kick.
>> Anonymous
>>81840
nope, not gonna leave
>> Anonymous
>>81764
Headbutts and groin strikes are useful techniques, and some MMA does allow them, but finger/toe locks and eye gouging and too unreliable for a real fight. They're very small targets and not even guaranteed fight enders if you do manage to hit them.
>> Anonymous
>>80075

Brazilian jiu jitsu is far superior than any other martial art
>> noko Anonymous
cool
>> Anonymous
i used to take up aikido but recently started on learning muay thai, and not the sporty kind.

protip: to avoid fights, don't engage into one.

if you don't want to hurt your opponent badly, use aikido.

if you want to brawl and hurt the fag, use muay thai

???

profit!
>> Anonymous
"MMA" as a brand is overcommercialized bullshit. Stay away from "MMA" schools.

MMA as a CONCEPT is in essence the perfection when striving for a perfect fighting form. A true mixed martial artist, therefore, is not one that has joined an 'mma school' and learned all his thigh kicks and calf kicks at the same time he's learned his grappling techniques and boxing. A true mixed martial artist is one that's learned AT LEAST one style properly, and then once he knows enough to actually be a good fighter, piles extra experience on top of it. Nobody becomes a good fighter in a year.

To answer the OP's question, from my personal experience and without bragging about my credentials, I will say that imho, karate is a great starting point for any fighter, but depending on the style in which it is taught it can either be massively overhyped or grossly underestimated.

However, the karate way is a great way to start MMA training, as it allows for the basics to be taught and a solid fighting form to be developed, on which more elegant and effective muay thai techniques should be added to transform the fighter, and brazilian jiujitsu techniques should also be applied in order to perfect his maneuverability in any situation.


TL;DR: Stay away from MMA schools. Start with a good karate school. Take Muay Thai and BJJ classes after and I swear that in a few of years you'll be able to kick some serious ass. And don't forget we're talking about martial ARTS-- you don't perfect this shit overnight.
>> Anonymous
>>82244
It only takes a few months to learn enough grappling to destroy any untrained at grappling opponent, and while we still have people suggesting karate as a good first martial art they'll be plenty of those about. Hitting people is intuitive enough that you can get by on just size and strength, but what to do when you're tied up on the ground is not at all obvious. Of course you should learn striking too, but grappling has so much better rewards for the time spent you'd be an idiot not to learn at least the basics of BJJ first.
>> Anonymous
>>82256
if you come near me i'll headbutt you in the dick.
>> Anonymous
>>82256
You are very right, but I was talking about what it takes to build a good FIGHTER.

Pure grappling does have its limitations.

And let's not forget, a fighter doesn't only show himself in the ring. What about real life situations?

Trust me, I'd be the LAST person to not grapple someone attacking me on the street. But the problem is, brawls are never one-on-one. So trust me, the kickboxing is needed. And the karate is what brings it all together, allowing you to integrate your basic self defences with your thrashing kickboxing abilities and, when you get to that big guy that knows how to fight, your groundfighting skills.

But for one on one fighting, and when you're talking about returns vs time, you are definetely right that bjj is superiorly efficient and effective. But not perfect. I was talking about perfection in form.

In fact, if I was to pick just ONE "martial ART", ie not allowing me to use any techniques from another artform whatsoever, you know what I'd go for? I'd go for the oldest one there is: pankration. The ancient greeks recognized the need for powerful and efficient striking combined with superior groundfighting, and it took us thousands of years to remember this. But that's a different story.

For learning to fight quickly - bjj = AWESOME
For greatness, you need more. Much, much more.
>> Anonymous
BJJ is awesome if you're 100% positive nobody else will interefere in the fight. Or else, you'll get your head stomped.
>> Anonymous
>>82301
or you could, y'know, make friends and go to clubs with them so when the other guy's friends try to stomp you, they'll get involved.

also if you are on the ground, it's infinitely preferable to be on top. can't run away if you're on bottom. hard to know how to escape mount or hit a sweep if you've never done any sort of grappling.
>> Anonymous
>>82292

Modern MMA should be like how pankration was. MMA + biting/eye gouging/limb breaking/clawing = perfection of fighting.
>> Anonymous
Something I would like to point out is that in both karate and aikido is that you can pin your attacker and stay standing on two feet or in an upright position, you don't have to go to the ground to pin someone.
>> nj
You are lost on muay thai if you think its elegant, and by being elegant you will be elevated to the level of a elite fighter status. Muay thai is the most effective, devastating striking system today.
>> nj
Oh, and are you guys really wondering about eye gouging? How is someone supposed to evolve as a fighter if every round someone inflicts possibly career ending wounds. You think GSP could have 15 wins if every fight some fuckhead tried to gouge out his eyes?
>> Anonymous
>>82458
If he was willing to risk fighting under those rules, probably yes. Eyes are a very small target, eye gouging is a very unreliable move. If you're in good position to gouge the eyes you've already won.
>> Anonymous
     File :-(, x)
>>82468
>> Anonymous
>>82322
That's just stupid. We're talking about what YOU can do against other guys alone. I have massive beasty friends with 3 and 4 dans in karate and years of MMA training that could beat the shit out of anybody. Doesn't mean they're gonna be there every single time I go out.

>>82442
That's also stupid. As someone that's experienced in both karate AND bjj, I'd like to state right now that there is absolutely no pure karate fighter on earth that could pin down another bjj fighter of equal skill and win the fight.

There ARE moves for when you're on your back and the opponent is standing, you know.

In fact, imo there is no pure karate fighter that could beat a bjj fighter of equal skill and abilities in a one on one fight. It just doesn't work out.
>> Anonymous
>>82869

Depends on what kind of karate. Kyokushin fighters have the knockout ability like muay thai fighters.
>> Vul !!e95V2fmCESS
     File :-(, x)
Conditioning matters too. Those techniques won't account for much if you're too weak or slow to perform them.

You need to lift heavy weights
>> Anonymous
>>82869
One of the common "BJJ SUX" arguments is that you get stomped on by the other guy's friends. I'm just saying that that goes both ways - it's not impossible that you roll with friends too. Wait, this is 4chan, yes that is impossible. Carry on.
>> Anonymous
If you are training in fighting because of some half-assed fantasy that you are readying yourself for the Ultimate Barfight Scenario, please find a new hobby. That kind of nonsense only happens in movies and adolescent fantasies and can get you badly injured. It doesn't take much planning, manpower, motivation, or know-how to send someone to the ER and months of recovery or worse. In all the "what-if" situations people have described to me, they have great plans and skills, but never account for the unknown gun, knife, bottle, brick, stick, pipe, car, extra opponent, momentary distraction, mistimed punch, slipped grab, etc. Too many things can go wrong and make the best plan end badly. Martial arts are fine if you intend to fight in the ring, or in some controlled environment. But thinking that training in such will translate into anything more than a questionable brand of schoolyard fighting skills when attempted in a confrontation you aren't planing on could end with you in the hospital or worse. Some people take up combative training or take unnecessary risks to feel tough in a threatening environment. Don't confuse feeling tough and in control with actually being in control.
To those of you training in fighting who have shed the street tough mentality, keep up the hard work. It has many benefits. To the ones who still plan for the "inevitable" street fight... if you ever see one, I hope you make it out okay.
>> Anonymous
This is exactly my point with fencing. If you're learning epee you can strike anywhere on the body. As far as "grabbing the stick"...That's a good way to end up with tendon damage or a broken bone or getting thrown way out of position. Because the fencer's moves are so quick, they generate enough force to damage the body easily. Furthermore, fencing has moves to avoid contact as well as create it. Attempting a grab could get you wrapped on the arm fairly fiercely.

While fencing doesn't emphasize strength, quickness can be a devastating edge in a fight. Like other posters have said, if you're better able to connect with your opponent (and having a 2-3 ft long extension of your arm helps a lot) and you have a speed advantage, chances are your opponent is not going to succeed. Trick moves are exactly that, trick moves. Go for the quickest knock-out move you have. With an extra 2-3 feet and the rather large extension from a lunge, you can easily close with an opponent long before he can punch or kick you.

A lot of the people on this thread are quick to judge things they have little experience with, so I think a lot of this thread will end up in MA-peen comparisons.
>> Anonymous
>>82869
oh lol. you know the last fight i saw with somebody on the ground there were three people standing around him kicking him in the head with steel capped boots. precisely as you are not allowed to do in bjj and mma, and i wonder for what reasons. he left in an ambulance.

bjj that. saging this cock stroking thread.