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Anonymous
If all of the primate order vanished from the face of earth, what would take the place of humans, supposing earth would be able to sustain life and evolution for the next billion of years?

(pic related, they're one of the most intelligent beings after humans and chimpanzees)
>> Anonymous
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Hello. Hello. Arrr!
>> Anonymous
Hey, it's not all about intelligence. The dinosaurs dominated the planet for what, 150, 160 million years? Although a lot of them were far from the dumb giant lizards of popular imagination, their intelligence wasn't their big selling point, like us.
>> Anonymous
Japanese crows using ongoing traffic as a nutcracker. Superior.


video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-7329182515885554944

Maybe more than one species will be able to reach the level of humans, and eventually they will clash and enter on conflict for rulership of planet earth.
>> Anonymous
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>>218150

I'm pretty sure if dinosaurs were still around when the first proto-human beings appeared, we would've dominated them regardless, just like we did with those guys on the last ice age.
>> Anonymous
Elephants, corvids and parrots, most likely. Sheep are also more intelligent than many people think, they're excellent at recognizing and remembering individual faces.
Octopi also use tools and recognize individuals.
>> Anonymous
>>218154
Is that relevant to this subject? I don't see how.
My point was you can be a successful species without huge brainpower.
>> Anonymous
>>218158

My point was that you can't, if there's a species far more intelligent than yours.
>> Anonymous
>>218154
It's also worth noting that early hominids would have been prey rather than predator. It would not have been until the relatively recent arrival of multi-component tools that they would have been able to turn the tables, and even then the hunting of predators would only have been undertaken in situations of absolute need, or for social purposes rather than for food.

>>218160
I don't agree. For instance, pigs are far more intelligent than lions. In a world without humans, would the pigs dominate the lions? I think not.
>> Anonymous
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swinging from the trees!
>> Anonymous
>>218161

If pigs developed the ability to use tools and stick to groups, which would be the more likely for intelligent species, then yes.
>> Guodzilla
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>>218167
Watch "The Future is Wild" from BBC.
>> Anonymous
>>218168
What? You've got it back to front. The evolutionary pressure for us to become more intelligent came from our ability to use tools, not the other way round. It went like this:

1 Bipedalism/freeing up of the hands
2 The ability to manipulate objects as tools
3 Tools lead to better diet, better diet allows bigger brains/smaller gut.
4 Bigger brains allow further development of our tool making and use, and the beginnings of the thing which REALLY allows us to dominate the world, our culture.

The pig/lion scenario you outline is not credible. If the pigs would dominate the lions, their ancestors had millions of years to do it before we showed up. Needless to say, they didn't.
>> Anonymous
>>218170
From what evidence has come to light recently, a straight bipedal gait is the ancestral condition of hominids. We didn't evolve from quadrapedal knuckle-walkers, the knuckle-walking apes actually evolved from early bipeds. And it seems likely that our common ancestor with chimps already used tools. So, you can go into various directions from the same beginnings. We still don't really know which changes were the causes and which the consequences in human evolution.
>> Anonymous
>>218170

I was not necessarily referring to pigs, but beings with much more intelligence than the others.

Such as humans.
>> Anonymous
>>218175
So what did the early bipedal apes evolve from? The gait is a product of the environment. Arboreal vs savannah, in this case.
>> Anonymous
>>218179
Arboreal apes. Orangutangs still move bipedally when they have to walk on land, and there is evidence that early african apes of the human-chimp lineage had an upright posture despite living in trees. It may be that humans remained bipedal because they lived in an open environment where seeing the predators in the long grass would have been difficult otherwise, while chimps had more to gain from adopting a quadrapedal posture in the jungle.
>> Anonymous
>>218196
Agreed, we may have come from an arboreal ape which was bipedal on the ground, it makes very good sense in fact; we know we're talking about a time of shrinking forests, those apes able to stand upright would have had an easier time adapting to a savannah environment.
That doesn't affect the order in which our evolutionary advances arrived. I think the nub of the issue was which came first, tool use or the increase in intelligence. I took the position that tool use leads to greater intelligence, rather than greater intelligence leading to tool use.
>> Anonymous
>>218167
Fuck yeah cephalopods!
>> Anonymous
Crows or Octopi. Pigs, Elephants and Dolphins would need to evolve something to use tools or build with. Crows and Octopi already have the basics.

Mice are too small. It could happen I just doubt it.

Because the first one to evolve into something that uses tools efficiently will suppress all other animals. There can only be one.
>> Anonymous
>>218245
Elephants have trunks. What they need is a motivation. They could easily become tool users if they just benefited from it somehow.

Crows, on the other hand, already use tools, pretty much for the same reasons our ancestors did. They're a pretty safe bet.
>> Anonymous
cockroaches.
meaning of life is reproduction and were geting our asses kicked by these guys
>> Anonymous
>>218256
I think Elephants size is their biggest drawback. They already are pretty damn smart as it is, they probably just need to grow smaller bodies with softer skin to provoke more tool use. I wonder if our poaching of tusked elephants will somehow cause this, assuming we don't just drive them to extinction.
>> Anonymous
>>218263
You're right, clearly there are signs of cockroach domination all across the earth. All of those cities and highways you see? All built by the roaches. They build their cities and then we come and try to move in.
>> Anonymous
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JEWS
>> Anonymous
Birds.
>> Anonymous
Elephants would be the dominant race until some other species evolved thumbs. Intelligence is useless if all you can do is peck, shit, and make annoying noises.
>> Anonymous
>>218794

Niggers?
>> Anonymous
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>>218794
Seriously, have you never heard that elephants have TRUNKS?
>> Anonymous
rats.
>> Anonymous
Evolution is an unproven theory.
We were put here by god and will be here until god has had enough of us. there will be no other dominate species on this planet unless god sees otherwise.
>> Anonymous
>>218145
Why are those two pigs kissing each other?
>> Anonymous
>>218824
0/10

No effort.
>> Anonymous
>>218824
lol trolls
>> Anonymous
>>218803
Yeah? And I could kick an elephants ass. I'd use a pointy stick, and a colorful frogs stuck on the end or something. I can do that because I have THUMBS. Plural. I'd be hamfucked if I only had one.
>> Anonymous
GENERALIST ANIMALS because they will usually be able to thrive even when their environment changes drastically

pigeons
seagulls
rats
corvids
raccoons
opossums
cockroaches
ants

no, its not coincidence that these ones do well around humans. they will do well if humans disappear and the environment goes wacky. without humans, these animals will speciate and create new evolutionary branches
>> Anonymous
>>218839
Right. You are going to survive being kicked, trampled, being thrown around and impaled on a tusk because you have thumbs, plural. This also explains how elephants can kill rhinos: elephant has one "thumb" while the rhinos have none.
>> Anonymous
>>218845
Maybe it's because I'm tired, but you made me ROFL.
>> Double Nigger
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>> Anonymous
>>218824
Go back to bed Pastor Brown, the big boys are talking and we don't need imaginary friends involved.
>> Anonymous
>>218824
I suggest you look up the definition of 'theory' in any scientific dictionary.

Also, no god exists.
>> Anonymous
>>218938
So Humans are the only and first 'intenlegent' creatures to ever exist? I doubt that...
>> Anonymous
NOBODY EXPECTS THE AARDVARK!
>> Anonymous
>>218953
Well on Earth they sure as hell are.
>> Anonymous
>>218145
>pig related
>> Anonymous
>>218955

The aardvark is about as wacky as Ferrets becoming the dominant species.
>> Anonymous
I personally believe it would be the apex, pack predators of the local region. Wolves, lions, etc.
>> Anonymous
>>218976
I assumed the question was about what species might evolve into a sapient being capable of altering the environment with technology, not what animal would be on top of the food chain.
>> Anonymous
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My vote is for kea's. They can already solve complicated puzzles, tear apart a car, and kill sheep.
>> Anonymous
Okay, let's assume dolphins and squids stay in the sea where the possibility to develop a humanlike culture are somewhat limited. Let's also not look at the apes, because another one of those would be kind of boring to consider here. Okay, my next guess then would be another monkey... what's not really much more exciting.

Considering all the remaining species, I think raccoons should have the biggest chance to evolve into the most developed species similar to humans. Their paws are already close to those of monkeys. (And our hands were obviously very important in the process of evolution.) They have a good memory and are adaptable. This means that they won't die out because of a sudden climate change. Another plus is that we have successfully elimanted or decimated several of their biggest enemies in the past. However there are also some problems. It is not known that the old deliberately teach their young. They are also relatively short lived with 20 years at max. It is also a problem that their social relationship to each other is not as strong as in other species. Colaberative hunting seems to be very important for the development of the brain. On the other hand they don't constantly kill each other like many species which is an exclusion criterium in my eyes. I think that with some selective breeding, the general intelligence of a raccoon group could be brought higher than the one of the smartest Border Collies within several dozen years.

However, if you look at any species besides monkeys, you will always encounter some serious problems with them. Mainly anatomically. Elephants are way too big to build small devices and would need way too much food for a bigger population. Because of this I think raccoons are promising, because they are one of the very few species without serious flaws in their anatomy.

tl;dr: Raccoons have handlike frontpaws and are thus superior.
>> Anonymous
>>220364
You seem to have forgotten that all primates were supposed to be extinct. Not that it matters in the case of raccoons, just pointing that out.

I wonder how much of a problem the lack of human-like hands really is. Based on other apes, our ancestors probably didn't have very deft hands before they had at least ape-level intelligence. Corvids and parrots are said to have at least ape-level intelligence plus some corvids already make tools. Evolution works with what it has, so the next sapient species may use super-evolved beaks instead of super-evolved forepaws...
>> Anonymous
All this talk, but what about ants?
They are clyinical, 100% effective at everything they do and the many differant species have a huge array of natural weapons at their disposal, they are the things you should be looking at for supremicy. If they were a little bigger nothing would stop them.
>> Anonymous
It could be any animal that is reasonably intelligent and has body parts deft enough for tool use.
>> Anonymous
If humans/primates were to be extinct, I'm pretty sure it would just happen the same way all over again, except without stepping all the way back into dinosaur days since many species still exist. No longer intimidated by urban sprawl, all hardier animals would multiply, both predator and prey. Carnivores like wild dogs would have their hay-day and rule for a bit. Meanwhile, shy little rat-like mammals would slowly ascend their way into becoming primates, and then humanoid.

Birds are definitely smart, but have no reason to become terrestrial and making fires and whatnot. While it's slightly more likely that pigs could evolve, I just can't see the species having the drive to become bipedal when they already live pretty posh lives in the forest. Even though they can be prey animals, pigs aren't exactly bunnies. At least rodent-like things have a reason to strive for becoming primates and then working their way to the top of the foodchain.
>> Anonymous
>>218145
insects
>> Anonymous
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>>220519
>>Birds are definitely smart, but have no reason to become terrestrial

Hello.
>> Anonymous
>>220864
Said birds fill an evolutionary niche, and therefore are essentially fucked in case of evolution. If the environment changes, they will not. Thats the problem with specialization. See: Dodo.
>> Anonymous
>>221136
Dodos evolved in isolation, on an island with no predators. Ratites evolved flightlessness in the presence of every predator imaginable, and have survived for about 50 million years in this state. It's much more likely that humans are going to get fucked and die than flightless ratites.

Also, it's become fairly clear that a lot of the most succesful feathered dinosaurs are actually early birds that became flightless again.
>> Anonymous
I like the Pig on the left side of the picture
>> Anonymous
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>>220519
they have already conquered the cats, they are coming for you next!
>> Anonymous
Noone considered crabpeople?
>> Hyper Cutter !XQ6W0CNp/o
Octopi would be a force to be reckoned with if their lives weren't so damn short.