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Anonymous
/an/, I have a question regarding aliens. (Aliens = not human = /an/)

Do you think we would be instinctively afraid of aliens? Even if they looked a lot like us, they would be creatures created by a different evolution. They would be something ... other.

Even if they were friendly, I think we would be afraid of them on a deep-rooted, instinctual level that we couldn't do anything about.
>> Anonymous
If that were true, you would be instinctively afraid of almost anything living on earth. Are you?
>> Anonymous
Humans are animals.
>> Anonymous
I see what you mean, and I say not everybody would be.
Some are afraid of the unknown, as an instinct, however some are merely highly curious.
Some are too horny and would just want to fuck it.
so yeah, mixed reactions, not all scared
>> Anonymous
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could go both ways, humans tend to be at minimum dichotomic in every way i can think of. so while what you mentioned would definitely be present, there would certainly be an irrepressible urge of attraction present as well. Some people would experience more of the former while others the latter, but i think both would definitely be present in equal strength within our species collective conscious.

TLDR: Yes but humans are bipolar fucks and would thus be equally attracted as they would repulsed.
>> Demyx's Blue-Marine !!vjyCRKGc15d
if they're anything like aliens depicted in most movies, we'd have good reasons to fear them. Though defeating a Yautja and earning eternal respect from his whole race would be nice.
>> Anonymous
>Even if they looked a lot like us

Naw dude, naw. Not going to happen.
>> Anonymous
I think it depends on a lot on the circumstances. If you're out camping in the woods and you see strange lights and then shadowy and ghostly figures moving through the threes you will probably shit a brick. If on the other hand aliens land on your street in broad daylight with plenty of other people around you'll probably be awestruck, then maybe scared. It depends a lot on what they look like.
>> Anonymous
>>329406
It honestly depends on what the aliens look like. Not all living things on earth look alike. If they were to look like angler fish (fuck) then hell yes I would be instinctively scared with all those teeth. But they looked somewhat like humans, I would be less apprehensive. Then again, looks may be deceiving. Oh well, I guess we'll find out eventually.
>> Anonymous
I would think that while certain people would be afraid, like me, some people would also be very interested.

I have no idea what the aliens would think, though. They could be a race of merciless conquerors, getting to know our planet before they attack us with their genitalia that have automatic firing.
>> Anonymous
OH, DUDE.

WHAT IF AN ALIEN RACE CAME TO EARTH, AND THEY WERE ALL SUPER HOT, AND THEY WERE ALL SUPER INTERESTED IN FINDING OUT HOW WE REPRODUCED?
>> Anonymous
>>329429

Just fyi, fucking pigs isn't the best way to find out how pigs reproduce.
>> Anonymous
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I believe we'd be instinctively distrusting of aliens. Why? Because they are different. They are not "us". This is something that is deeply ingrained to our gentics: we separate all beings as "us" and "them". This comes from our primitive primate ancestors, but is still alive and well in all human beings today. The difference between "us" and "them" does not have to be anything more than the colour of your shirt, but if it's your language, your religion or the colour of your skin, the reaction is all the more powerful and more difficult to overcome.

Now imagine that we meet a creature that looks like the ill-begotten lovechild of a king crab and a lizard. We would without the slightest doubt subconsciously classify them as "them". We'd expect them to always put their best interests first and doublecross all of us before turning against one of their own. We'd do this because it's natural, instinctual. Speciecism would be far stronger than racism has ever been and much harder to get over.

And it's on top of this unfortunate fact that we'd see all the other phobias pile over. There's the obvious suspicion of new things, as they'd be something we'd never seen before: a sapient being that is not human. They'd shatter our normal classification of living things into sapients (humans) and non-sapients (all the other animals). They'd also frighten people whose religious belief can't accommodate alien intelligences (they'd probably think the aliens are demons from hell). And they might look so strange as to trigger our fears with just their very alienness. It would be hard to overcome pure disgust if they looked too horrifying to us, even if they had only the best of intentions in mind.

There are a whole lot of problems aliens would have to face and overcome before there could be any kind of lasting interaction between our species. A species with peaceful intentions might even choose never to actually meet us for this very reason.
>> Anonymous
Yes > No
For a number of reasons I think we can easily be afraid of them. It could be for good reasons...

Look at how afraid people are of things they already don't understand... Example - Spiders
>> Anonymous
>>329431

On the flipside, you'll notice that the greater the differences, the more we band together with those who are less different.

ie if we had speciesism, racism would take a backseat.
>> Anonymous
>>329483
Indeed. Suddenly "us" would mean "humankind" rather than "caucasians" or "people of african descent" or whatever. Of course it could work even further, if we had to ally with some alien organisms against, say, an autonomous robotic menace seeking to wipe organic life from the galaxy.
>> Anonymous
>>329483
>>329485

Quick! Someone stage a neverending alien/robot invasion so humanity can be at peace!
>> Anonymous
>>329506
I did that 35 minutes ago.
>> Anonymous
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>>329431

I really don't think so, at least depending on whqat you mean by "we". Looking at the general population, yeah, I can see a general sense of distrust, possibly more so than due to racism, but that's not the same at universal fear or hatred or panic. To really lok at something like this you'd probably need some kind of specrtum distibution chart that esimates the relative amount of people with any of a range of reactions. I'm thinking a distribution like this might happen (see image). But hey, I'm kind of a weirdo, so whatever.
>> Anonymous
>>329483
What if we had racist speciesism? Like the aliens only understood the japanese mindset or were communists, and so only sided with certain humans who shared their worldview. Spaceview?
>> Anonymous
>>329431
You have no idea how hot I am for you right now after reading your input.
>> Anonymous
You know, I'm wondering if it's even possible to imagine what aliens would look like. Because all the aliens we've imagined still have some features of anatomy unique to Earth. Also, why the fuck do all aliens of a species look like clones when we imagine them?
>> Anonymous
If we ever meet aliens I'd pray that they walk on 2 legs and wear clothes, because otherwise I'd be afraid people would want to kill them immediately for being so...alien.
>> Anonymous
>>329784

It's only possible to imagine an alien species if it comes from a similar environment as Earth. They could have some similarities, if nearly every environmental condition was like ours.

But I really doubt that spacefaring civilizations will be biological. Complex biological organisms have so far proven to be shit in space. Extended periods of time in space destroys our biological bodies and any other means of crossing space seem like they would be just as taxing on our biology. If our technological progress is any indicator, any sufficiently advanced organism would be integrated with their own technology. So we're looking at cybernetic organisms traveling through space to visit us. Granted, we would have no idea what form their technology would take, so it could be alien enough that whether or not it's technology or biology becomes irrelevant.
>> Anonymous
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>>329431
>And they might look so strange as to trigger our fears with just their very alienness. It would be hard to overcome pure disgust if they looked too horrifying to us, even if they had only the best of intentions in mind.

Agreed. If one of these fellows stepped out of a flying saucer and said, "Greetings, human. I am a benevolent creature and wish to impart to you an immunity to all ailments and diseases," I'd still run screaming.
>> Anonymous
>>329843
All I know is, if they look like the Alien from Alien, I fucking locking myself in a panic room and never leaving.
>> Anonymous
>>329843

I would welcome it, and ask it if it wanted to yiff.
>> Anonymous
>>329784
I think it's tasking for the imagination enough to come up with a plausible alien. It would be even harder to come up with subtle physiological differences that can be used to tell individuals apart. It's the "they all look the same to me" phenomenon in a much larger scale.

>>329821
I think it might be impossible to tell alien cybernetics apart from alien organisms at a glance by the time they reach interstellar travel technology. Already our focus is shifting from crude inorganic tech towards biotechnology, and we haven't even been to the nearest planet yet. It also doesn't seem likely that people would accept most cybernetic enhancements unless they can be made to mimic normal organic body parts closely enough, at least if they're visible. So if the aliens are anything like us mentally (which is more likely than them being very similiar to us anatomically) they may look almost exactly like their natural organic ancestors but be using completely synthetic super-durable bodies.
>> Anonymous
George A. Romero's Day of the Dead. Watch it and you will know the answer to this thread.
>> Anonymous
>>329907

But at what point do replacements with focus on reproducing natural abilities become a limitation? You know that humans would never settle for simple slightly re-engineered body parts. The main thing we would focus on would be increasing brain capacity and processing power. To a certain point, we'd probably settle for the typical human form, but I think after a decent bit of progress is put into the whole thing, we'd stop caring about the typical form and "evolve" into something a lot more realistic and practical for whatever purpose we might imagine in the future.

If that purpose is space travel, then what's the point of even having a body if you could find ways around that, like uploading your mind into a computer directly on your space vehicle? That would circumvent almost all life-support requirements other than keeping the mind(s) intact.

Talking about it like this, I can't help but realize that everything we could imagine about extraterrestrials is based on our possible future outcomes as a technological society. At least if you're trying to be sensible, and not talking about the gray aliens who fly around in hurr durr flying saucers and reak of anthropomorphism.
>> Anonymous
>>329918
It's easy to get caught up in futuristic fantasy visions of transhumanists, but we need to remember that such changes will have the huge mass of the general public weighing them down. Consider how old-fashioned people are about such inorganic additions to our appearance as clothes. Since it was decided about a millennium ago that skirts are for girls, it has proven nigh impossible to sell them to men, and even then only for a small rebellious niche market.

If we can feel that strongly about a piece of cloth that's not even part of our body, how open are we going to be to changing the appearances of our physical bodies? A very small minority might prefer a shiny metallic arm to his biological one, but even in the case of losing one, people are more likely to choose prosthetics that look and feel like the real thing. The genetic programming that allowes us to recognize others of our species and find attractive mates are going to fight long and hard against any radical changes to our appearance. It will be more about getting over a change or getting used to it than embracing it forthright. And we should not forget how much we use our senses subconsciously to evaluate other people. One cannot sniff for a prospective mate in a world made of silicon people.

Then again, it's not the general public that will be riding the interstellar express to study strange new worlds but dedicated professionals. They would have to be more open to physical changes less palatable for the public, even if took them as far as losing their humanity entirely. In this sense it may be more likely that the aliens we meet will barely resemble the beings that designed and built their ship in some far-off solar system. But as long as a species holds on to the last remnants of their original genetic abilities and needs, the things that define them as a species, they will always want to hang on to something that looks and feel familiar.
>> Anonymous
>>329914
I don't remember any aliens in Day of the Dead. Reanimated human corpse != alien.
>> Anonymous
>>329431[phobias]

This is a very reasonable assumption, but we could examine this "third level contact" over similar happenings in our own world.

Aliens arriving and interacting with earth would most probably we much akin to the west discovering America. The initial expeditions would be done by explorers, which would probably be mostly non-hostile, but continued interaction with the species would bring the larger bulk of the populace to visit and colonize the earth.

It is safe to assume that a spacefaring civilization would exhibit at least some amount of altruistic behavior in order to not have nuked itself to extinction and actually got itself off it's rock. Thus, the fear of annihilation fo our species is pretty far-fetched.

In actuality, for all we know and have examined in the universe, life seems to be mostly possible when it's related to oxygen, carbon and water. The aliens probably wouldn't look like us, but they wouldn't be utterly unimaginable. Their bodies would burn oxygen and consume carbon hydrates. They would have hands or some limbs to interact with their environment. They would probably have evolved from a social, omnivorous or herbivorous species, etc.

This doesn't mean they couldn't be a bit disgusting or ugly to our eyes, but they'd hardly have the appearance of an open wound infested with maggots. Thus, we would adapt and learn to forget it.
>> Anonymous
>>329981[continuing]

This doesn't mean that their culture would be instinctively understandable and familiarizable, but it's very hard to imagine it would differ from ours in a noticeably larger scale than the earth cultures differ from each other. Thus, after their colonization began, it's easy to imagine the contact would divide both us and them into distinct camps of thought. There would be some that were instinctively foreigner-friendly, would act as ambassadors, try to adapt into each other's cultures and understand us. They would 'inflirtate' us as much as we would inflirtate them.

The majority of populace would be uninterested much as majority of us consider our culture superior and want little to do with other people's cultures. Not because we hate them, but because we don't care and can't be forced to care. The aliens would initially be a source of bewilderment, but as generations passed and people were born in a reality where differences in species are as much of a commodity as differences in a race. Then there's the smaller, in all probablility, largely uneducated group of people (as much in their part as ours) that would be openly racist and openly violent and threatening.
>> Anonymous
>>329982

But just take a look in USA now. After the civilized manners struck in, it's still taken them generations until either the blacks or women are treated equally compared to the white man. Between species, it'd take longer. Of course, we would have the added benefit of the both sides of the equation being (hopefully) a lot more civilized than at the times of the western colonization of earth. Our religious savages mostly base their worldviews on humans being above all others or somehow special. With the advent of other spacefaring civilizations, the carpet would be just about taken off their feet just as it would long ago be taken off the feet of the aliens' religious savages. It's safe to say that colonists arriving here wouldn't be of the most conformist section of their society, but they'd hardly be nutcases.

Things would really get interesting about the time when the last persons who ever knew the reality wherein the Earth was the center of the universe were dead. As much in their part as in ours. Because, at this point we would see the rise of people to whom the race would be of no concern. There'd be xenophiles or people who felt they belonged with the aliens more than they belong with us. There'd be people who moved to other worlds to socialice with whatever else there is and TV series would begin to have the token alien much akin to the token black guy that would play on speciecial (is that even a goddamn word) stereotypes as well as racial.
>> Anonymous
>>329985[finally]

Actually, reflecting on that, if we met a spacefaring civlilization, it'd be hard to imagine that they hadn't had an encounter like this before - assuming they were spacefaring already. In this case, the colony ships they shipped in would already contain examples of several different species. This would probably make their adaptation here easier even if it didn't make our adaptation to them easier.

Ohwell, any input on this. I wrote this after reading the thread and thinking on the subject a bit. It's entirely possible that my reasoning is flawed.

--

Sorry for tl;dr
>> Anonymous
>>329843
am i the only one who thinks xenomorphs are just cool looking and not really that repulsive anymore? Guess I'm desensitized after seeing the movies so many times.
>> Anonymous
>>329988

Yes and no.

I think they're cool. But I still have Aliens nightmares from time to time. Not in a "yuck, repulsive" -way but in the "they just keep on coming" -way.

In some ways, I think xenomorphs are the greatest alien species invention ever. They play directly on some of our fears. When you first see the movies as a kid, you're bound to freak out, but you'll grow to love them.
>> Anonymous
>>329982
>>but it's very hard to imagine it would differ from ours in a noticeably larger scale than the earth cultures differ from each other.

I have to disagree. It's fairly easy to imagine how their cultures could be more different. Human culture stems from our biology. We are pair-bonding apes with little differences between individuals or even genders. The aliens might be more like elephants, where the females from the "society" and males are antisocial outsiders. Either sex could even be a barely sentient parasite and all children reared in a communal nest. Or they might be eusocial creatures with one reproducing pair for each city, with everyone else being sterile siblings of the alpha pair. Our concepts of equality, freedom and individuality, not to mention family, might seem thoroughly alien to them.

I do think it likely they would be likely to be similiar to us mentally, though. And if the Earth's most sapient organisms are any indication, humans may be a fairly typical sapient species (dolphins, corvids & grey parrots are all pair-bonders with little sexual dimorphism).
>> Anonymous
>>329994

I've also had Alien nightmares. In addition to the physical might, the creatures had such threatening inevitability that you're bound to fear them. Best movie baddies ever IMO.

Though in recent years (after AvsP) the nightmares are ocassionally a lot more gamistic and not as scary anymore.
>> Anonymous
>>329988
Nope. I've always found them more awesome than awful. The Queen Alien especially. I sort of understand why people find them frightening, but ever since seeing Aliens in my teens, I've been fascinated by the aliens.
>> Anonymous
>>329995[sexual dimorphism]

I commented on the probably "breath oxygen, need water" -similarities the aliens would probably have, but I'm kind of unsure on whether they'd have a sexual reproduction system similar to ours.

The initial reproduction system of unicellular organisms was cell division, but there's a reason sexual reproduction is the norm here, and it's because dividing the possible combinatorics into two distinct sets produces more variety and enables sexually reproducing species to exhibit diversity and change on a different level than with species relying solely on random mutation.

This doesn't mean that it would be utterly improbably that the aliens' evolution would manufacture change in their DNA footprint (or equivalent) in a method other than sexuality, but it's not a given that their sexuality would be similar to ours. Consider some successful strategies we already have, such as ants or other social insects.
>> Anonymous
>>329998
Why did you choose to ignore the whole beginning of the message, including the bit about aliens with parasitic other sex or eusociality with one breeding pair per colony?
>> Anonymous
>>329998

But one thing I'd really bet on would be that the aliens would have a K-type reproduction strategy as opposed to type R (the game series R-Type actually means this). K-type strategy would encourage social behavior that would in turn encourage the establishment of societies and intelligence.

This is of course, mostly anthropic reasoning based on assuming the things we see are more probably than the things we don't see. But without any contradicting evidence and examining other semi-sapient species on earth, it'd seem the most viable assumption.

> and all children reared in a communal nest.

Not entirely unlikely that human culture could eventually take a turn for a system similar to this. Just as society has given everyone a chance to be a specialist in one field and increase our efficiency thus, leaving the children to 'professionals' could be just as viable.
>> Anonymous
>>330001

Didn't really have much input for it, also, was writing the other post.
>> Anonymous
>>330002
Humans can't do what many species with communal nesting like ostriches can, because human babies need to be breastfed for optimal health. Babies also tend to require one mother per a couple of infants to grow to be mentally stable. An egg-laying communal nester's infants would have to be more mentally self-sufficient from the beginning and you could start playschool-style rearing 24/7* with just a few carers right from hatching.

(*assuming that's the amount of hours and days in an alien time counting system)
>> Anonymous
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>> Anonymous
>>329405
i think its more interesting if the only sentient species we encounter are homo sapiens, think about it...we either engage in a galactic war or work together to exploit as many planets as we can.
>> Anonymous
>>330974
There isn't as much incentive to have peaceful relations with aliens. Unlike with rival tribes of humans, we cannot procreate with them. They will forever be rivals only. The only reason we would make peace would be because they're strong enough to put up a fight.
>> Anonymous
>>329431
I'm never going to buy into this "religious people can't accommodate the existence of aliens" bullshit. The US is a majority god-fearing nation yet many people in the US believe aliens have come here and that the government knows about it! The Middle East might have a problem, but that's it.
>> Anonymous
>>330996

I don't think it would matter whether we liked them or not. It's not like humans are a significant interstellar presence right now. If we manage to become one, then we'd probably be intelligent and reasonable enough to not fuck with others.

Humans can benefit from peaceful relations with aliens. We're an intelligent species, and if we become significantly space-faring, we would have greater priorities than just mating. Even if that's the basal drive for us to continue to spread our species into the universe, we'd have more complex goals directly in mind.

You have to give us some credit. It's not like we're ruled by primitive instinct completely.
>> Anonymous
>>330974
>>exploit as many planets as we can.

If we keep at this hyper-capitalistic "let's exploit every natural resource over it's abilities to recover as long as we can" madness, we'll run out of planets before we get off of the first one. Seriously, unless we find a middle road between unsupportable unchecked growth and stagnation, we will not be able to get to the point where we develop interstellar flight technology. We'll just fester on this planet until we get buried by our own shit. Maybe that is what happens to most civilizations, and that's why there's nobody else around to come and meet us.